HELP! Road Runner is prison, or any garage door repair guys out there?

[Skytrooper]

"Overhead Door" has the North East sewn up....

Overhead Door Company is who I worked for ! A franchise based out of Lewiston, PA (I worked in Rochester, NY)

 

[Skytrooper]

After you replace the broken spring, make sure that your cables are properly set in the drums before winding the springs. A lot of the time, a cable will "jump" the drum, or come unwound when a spring breaks.

With both springs broken (according to OP) there will not be any tension on the cable and will most likely just be dangling at this point

 

[Ironbuilt]

With both springs broken (according to OP) there will not be any tension on the cable and will most likely just be dangling at this point

Overhead Door Company is who I worked for ! A franchise based out of Lewiston, PA (I worked in Rochester, NY)

I got my start in the Ironworkers Union with a company called New Jersey Door Works. We did commercial and industrial rolling steel and sectional doors, as well as loading dock equipment. Overhead Door is mostly residential in N.J., though they do some small commercial.

 

[Ironbuilt]

With both springs broken (according to OP) there will not be any tension on the cable and will most likely just be dangling at this point

If cables are loose, winding them is simple. Set the cables on the drums and wind the shaft counter clockwise until both cables are tight. DON'T loosen the drums, it's not necessary. Once the cables are tight, lock a vice grip on the shaft and against the wall on the top of the shaft. that will keep tension on the cables as you wind the springs. Don't release the vise grip until you wind both springs and tighten the set screws. A 3/8 8 point "star" socket works great to tighten the set screws.

 

[moparedtn]

When I built my garage, I insisted on good old fashioned solid wood doors - heavy as hell, of course.
I did not like those thin metal doors they sell at the Harry Homeowner joints...
My brother found a set of 3 down past Atlanta where a high-dollar home from the 50's was getting
remodeled, so we loaded them up and dragged them up here.
What I didn't know - since I'd never fooled with garage doors before - was how many turns these
heavy-assed 10x9 doors were going to take (33 as I recall!).

I didn't have any of the original hardware, so those had to be tracked down (they take different, heavier
hardware than metal doors). A local old hardware had a bunch in a loft....
Had to go to the regional overhead door company to source the springs, though.
Dude gave me the two rods, some quick instructions on how to wind the springs and then said "don't
slip - and once you start, don't stop"...
About turn 10, I started understanding what he meant.

Needless to say, that many windings on that sort of setup can easily hurt a fella, no doubt.
I had the luxury of resting the rods against the wood frame of the garage when needed, so tightening
the bolts wasn't so bad once I got there.
The damn rods needed to be another foot long, so I employed some of my own "cheaters" to help.
The doors have been fine ever since (over a decade now, knock wood), but they take a lot of maintenance
in the form of lubrication and adjusting the poor 3/4hp openers I have on them.
In the end, I'm quite happy with these doors and I would have hated the metal ones.

You can do this, too - JUST BE CAREFUL. Watch some instructional videos on YouTube about what you're
getting into!

 

[Skytrooper]

I got my start in the Ironworkers Union with a company called New Jersey Door Works. We did commercial and industrial rolling steel and sectional doors, as well as loading dock equipment. Overhead Door is mostly residential in N.J., though they do some small commercial.

We did tons of commercial work. We had 2 commercial crews and 2 commercial servicemen. I was a union carpenter back then. I did rolling steel curtains, rolling steel and sliding fire doors, and commercial sectional doors.

 

[Skytrooper]

If cables are loose, winding them is simple. Set the cables on the drums and wind the shaft counter clockwise until both cables are tight. DON'T loosen the drums, it's not necessary. Once the cables are tight, lock a vice grip on the shaft and against the wall on the top of the shaft. that will keep tension on the cables as you wind the springs. Don't release the vise grip until you wind both springs and tighten the set screws. A 3/8 8 point "star" socket works great to tighten the set screws.

You can get away with that on split shafts. If it is on a 1 inch hollow tube, then you have to take them off to slide the springs off. we all learn different ways. I do 14 years experience making a living on garage doors. Star socket is awesome !

OP, Good Luck with the repair ! There is a lot of good advice from people who have tackled this job before.

 

[Ironbuilt]

You can get away with that on split shafts. If it is on a 1 inch hollow tube, then you have to take them off to slide the springs off. we all learn different ways. I do 14 years experience making a living on garage doors. Star socket is awesome !

OP, Good Luck with the repair ! There is a lot of good advice from people who have tackled this job before.

I don't have too much experience with residential, but that makes sense with a single hollow shaft. All of the doors that I did during my 16 years in the Ironworkers had either a split shaft, or in some big industrial cases, four shafts and as many as 8 springs. Most of my experience was with rolling steel and dock levelers.

 

[Billccm]

Split shaft. Picture below when spring 1 broke. The third service guy tried to clamp the spring and the left spring broke as he was working on it.

 

[Photon440]

I actually have the manual to the door that says "9.6 turns". Really?? How do you do 0.6 turns?
Odd that everybody over at FABO says don't do it I will die, and everyone over here is encouraging me to tackle the job?

We're mostly big block people over here.

 

[Ironbuilt]

Split shaft. Picture below when spring 1 broke. The third service guy tried to clamp the spring and the left spring broke as he was working on it.

View attachment 1089219 View attachment 1089220

It's not that difficult to replace those springs. Do you have enough room to slide the springs off the shaft to the side? If you don't, it's best to remove the shafts and assemble them on the ground. Then carry them up and reinstall. Start by unbolting the center coupler that bolts the 2 shafts together. Then, remove the bearing plates from the end of the shaft where it meets the tracks. Carefully remove the cable from the drum and lay it over the top roller. That would be a good time to inspect the cables for fraying and/or damage. Lay the shaft on top of the track and move to the spring hanger plate. While holding the shaft, unbolt the plate from the wall. A cordless impact is best so that you're not ratcheting the lag bolts forever. Carefully lower the shaft to the ground. Repeat process on the other side. Once on the ground, remove the drums by loosening the set screws and removing the key stock. Don't lose the key, it's important. Slide the drum off the shaft. The drums are side specific, so don't mix them up.
Unbolt old springs from the hanger plates. Install new springs, which are also side specific. Bolt the hanger plates on the new springs. Slide the drum on with key, but leave it loose. Carry them up and slide the drum end over the track. Bolt the hanger plate to the wall with the lag bolts. Slide the end bearing plate onto the shaft and bolt it back to the track and wall if it has a wall mount. Repeat on the other side. Now you're ready to start the winding process.
You will need a minimum of 3 vice grips to safely wind the springs.
Clamp 1 vice grip on each side above a roller to keep the door from lifting off the ground during winding.
Slide the shafts toward the center but don't bolt the coupler together. Insert the cable into the slot at the back of the drum. Slide the up against the bearing plate and, with the key installed, tighten the set screws. Wind the cable onto the drum by spinning the shaft until the cable is tight. Make sure that the cable is in the proper grooves on the drum. The cable should come off the back of the drum. While holding tension on the shaft, clamp a vice grip to the shaft and against the wall to keep tension on the cable. You don't want any slack on the cable. Now you are ready to start winding. Use a bright spray paint of welding chalk to draw a straight line long ways across the front of the spring, from hub to hub. Using winding bars, start winding the spring clockwise. Position your ladder so the your winding arm is in front of the winding hub, but your face is out of harms way. As you wind, the line you drew will spiral and multiply. Every line on the spring is 1 turn. If it calls for 9.5, I would go 10 turns on each spring because the spring is going to give as it breaks in. Once you have the desired amount of turns, tighten the set screws on the spring hub. Since you have a split shaft with a keyway, tighten one set screw into the keyway. Don't overtighten of you will break the set screw. Once the screws are tight, you can remove the vice grip from the shaft.
Repeat this process on the other side. After both springs are wound up, then you bolt the center coupler together.
Carefully remove the vice grips from the rollers. Keep your foot on the step plate of the door in case it wants to go up. Check the spring tension with the opener unhooked. The door should balance halfway in the opening.

 

[Billccm]

Thanks. I copied your text to a word document and will print it out doublespaced.
It just occurred to me that the Tucson garage door mafia might see this thread. I'm going to start looking over my shoulder as I go out and about.

If you guys don't hear from me you know what happened.

 

[toolmanmike]

Pull the release and lift the door.

 

[Billccm]

Screw drive is disengaged.

 

[69a100]

Odd that everybody over at FABO says don't do it I will die, and everyone over here is encouraging me to tackle the job?

Because A body people are pussies!

 

[Ironbuilt]

Pull the release and lift the door.

That door is heavy, he's going to need some help.

 

[Billccm]

I think I saw a shipping weight specification of 420 pounds. Its a Ideal Commercial door shipped out of Ohio I believe.

 

[toolmanmike]

Of course it is heavy and yes you will need some help. May be 3 or 4 people. It goes damn hard until the panels start turning horizontal then it get's easier. Have a couple pair of Vise Grips to clamp on the track so it's doesn't fall back down and for God's sake don't put your fingers close to where the panels split.

 

[moparedtn]

The door should balance halfway in the opening.

Thar she blows!
Found out I needed even MORE turns when I did this test afterwards - dang doors were heavy as hell!

 

[Skytrooper]

Split shaft. Picture below when spring 1 broke. The third service guy tried to clamp the spring and the left spring broke as he was working on it.

View attachment 1089219 View attachment 1089220

That is the trouble with blocking the spring. The spring wire is already fatigued, that is why it broke.

It's not that difficult to replace those springs. Do you have enough room to slide the springs off the shaft to the side? If you don't, it's best to remove the shafts and assemble them on the ground. Then carry them up and reinstall. Start by unbolting the center coupler that bolts the 2 shafts together. Then, remove the bearing plates from the end of the shaft where it meets the tracks. Carefully remove the cable from the drum and lay it over the top roller. That would be a good time to inspect the cables for fraying and/or damage. Lay the shaft on top of the track and move to the spring hanger plate. While holding the shaft, unbolt the plate from the wall. A cordless impact is best so that you're not ratcheting the lag bolts forever. Carefully lower the shaft to the ground. Repeat process on the other side. Once on the ground, remove the drums by loosening the set screws and removing the key stock. Don't lose the key, it's important. Slide the drum off the shaft. The drums are side specific, so don't mix them up.
Unbolt old springs from the hanger plates. Install new springs, which are also side specific. Bolt the hanger plates on the new springs. Slide the drum on with key, but leave it loose. Carry them up and slide the drum end over the track. Bolt the hanger plate to the wall with the lag bolts. Slide the end bearing plate onto the shaft and bolt it back to the track and wall if it has a wall mount. Repeat on the other side. Now you're ready to start the winding process.
You will need a minimum of 3 vice grips to safely wind the springs.
Clamp 1 vice grip on each side above a roller to keep the door from lifting off the ground during winding.
Slide the shafts toward the center but don't bolt the coupler together. Insert the cable into the slot at the back of the drum. Slide the up against the bearing plate and, with the key installed, tighten the set screws. Wind the cable onto the drum by spinning the shaft until the cable is tight. Make sure that the cable is in the proper grooves on the drum. The cable should come off the back of the drum. While holding tension on the shaft, clamp a vice grip to the shaft and against the wall to keep tension on the cable. You don't want any slack on the cable. Now you are ready to start winding. Use a bright spray paint of welding chalk to draw a straight line long ways across the front of the spring, from hub to hub. Using winding bars, start winding the spring clockwise. Position your ladder so the your winding arm is in front of the winding hub, but your face is out of harms way. As you wind, the line you drew will spiral and multiply. Every line on the spring is 1 turn. If it calls for 9.5, I would go 10 turns on each spring because the spring is going to give as it breaks in. Once you have the desired amount of turns, tighten the set screws on the spring hub. Since you have a split shaft with a keyway, tighten one set screw into the keyway. Don't overtighten of you will break the set screw. Once the screws are tight, you can remove the vice grip from the shaft.
Repeat this process on the other side. After both springs are wound up, then you bolt the center coupler together.
Carefully remove the vice grips from the rollers. Keep your foot on the step plate of the door in case it wants to go up. Check the spring tension with the opener unhooked. The door should balance halfway in the opening.

Right on target !!