sb 318 35 degrees initial timing?!?!?!?!

[charger318]

Has anyone here ever seen a engine run with 35 degrees initial timing? Broke in the new cam on 318 after break in i was checking stuff, timing was at 35 btdc? I used piston stop to check tdc and balancer is correct didnt slip outer ring? It ran fine and if u hit throttle she was good up to 3000 rpm oh so, no bucking or anything, i didnt rev it higher then that during break in? Me and the old man are stumped as to why it would be like that?

 

[Seventy]

marked wrong

 

[dieseldazzle]

Vacuum advance disconnected??

 

[charger318]

I checked the balancer with piston stop it is marked correctly.....when i checked it i just turned the motor over by hand using the balancer bolt and cap off distributor to see when rotor got to number one cylinder.

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It has a lunati cam in it, specs are.......220/[email protected] .475/.494 lift. 112 lsa.

 

[Derwud]

I had that on an old tired 318, before a new cam and chain and new dist.

 

[eric383]

I have seen this on an engine that the cam was installed retarded. Did you use a timing chain set that allowed you to advance or retard the cam?

 

[charger318]

Ya i put a new cam, lifters,intake,carb,heads,distributor, and ecu in. Did yours go back to normal after you changed the parts? No the sprockets and chain didnt have the advance and retard slots. I installed cam straight fot to dot?

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I ahould have degreed the cam but sense it isnt that big i figured just install straight up, as most people do and dont have issue....but it ran fine reved good, i had the distributor vacuum hooked to timed port on carb with that much initial timing plus mechanical which on my distributor is suppose to be all in by 3200 rpm that would be 35+24=60 btdc!!!!!!

 

[dieseldazzle]

I would disconnect the vacuum advance all the way even though its hooked to a ported source, just to be on the safe side. Then recheck it.

 

[charger318]

But if im turning the engine by hand so engine is off and the rotor gets to #1 on cap at 35 degrees the vacuum advance has nothing to do with the initial timing that i see on balancer u know what i mean. Im not using a timing light right now i just set it by ear and ran good, turn engine off line up rotor to 1 on cap look at balncer 35 degrees advance.

 

[dieseldazzle]

Uhmmmm dude you need to get a timing light on it.....

 

[charger318]

Ya i know but by doing it the way i am would you not see when the inital timing was? I just wanted to see what it was at and didnt have a timing light when i fired it up

 

[Cranky]

I've done a couple of low compression (one was 7.8-1) cammed engines with 25/50 but neither one liked more than 50 total. Put a known good light on it and see what it shows....

 

[eric383]

Dot to dot should be ok. Here is a interesting link on tuning. Good luck.
http://www.mopar1.us/engine2.html

 

[dieseldazzle]

Dude you need the engine running and at operating temperature then get a timing light on it. If you are saying that when you TDC the motor that the timing indicator is pointing at 35degrees on the balancer then thats a different issue broski.

 

[Cranky]

Using the dot method is fine if everything was machined as it was supposed to be when it was manufactured. IF the tolerances stacked up in one direction, the cam could be off by several degrees and that is why it's a good idea to degree in even a stock cam and yes, I have found a couple that were off enough to make the engine run like a slug....

 

[charger318]

Right now im getting the exhaust put back up. Then ill fire it up again and use a timing light to see what comes up for initial, ill unplug and cap vacuum advance also just to be safe. Ill let u guy know what i foind.

 

[440roadrunner]

But if im turning the engine by hand so engine is off and the rotor gets to #1 on cap at 35 degrees the vacuum advance has nothing to do with the initial timing that i see on balancer u know what i mean. Im not using a timing light right now i just set it by ear and ran good, turn engine off line up rotor to 1 on cap look at balncer 35 degrees advance.

You can NOT eye ball it. If you have a points distributor you can "static" time it. Get the marks set 'to where you want timing' RETARD the distributor so the points are closed (turn dist cw SB, or ccw B / RB) Then slowly advance distributor until points open. Look for spark or use a test light

If you have a breakerless dist. you can "wiggle" the distr. close to the trigger point and by going retard / advance several times, you can determine within a few degrees where its' at ---close enough to fire.

You can ALSO set the timing "on the starter" with a timing light.

GET a light you NEED one. You can NOT time these "by ear."

 

[moper]

So you honestly are estimating it's at 35 degrees. It might be. Engines will run with a ton of timing in some cases. But part of the difference between great tuners and average tuners is the details. Stop guessing, buy a cheap light and a $5 timing tape, and then "know".

 

[Cranky]

So you honestly are estimating it's at 35 degrees. It might be. Engines will run with a ton of timing in some cases. But part of the difference between great tuners and average tuners is the details. Stop guessing, buy a cheap light and a $5 timing tape, and then "know".

Well, there are a few good cheap timing lights just like there are a few junk expensive ones. In the 70's, Sears had one that turned out to be a rather good one and was advertised as 'Sears Best' if anyone remembers that kind of advertising. I've had one since the early 70's and had it checked years ago and it's still doing very well. Last year I found one new in the box on Ebag and it matches my old one. The part number is 28 2134. IIRC, I gave 25 bucks for it. Right after I got it, I stumbled across an article that was about timing lights and low and behold, this light got high marks. The first time I had what I thought was a timing issue with a low compression engine, I didn't trust the readings so I borrowed a known good 'expensive' light and got the same reading so went and got another light and it too gave me the same reading. So, don't just buy a cheap light. Do some research on them first and go from there. They are not created equally.....

 

[charger318]

I know it has been awhile but, after some carb tuning, and ignition work the engine is now running with 12 degrees inital and 36 total advance. Thanks for everyones help with this issue i had