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Bent cam?? Or other??

Lefty71

Lefty71

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This video popped up in my Email in a solicitation from Goodman (machine tools). Great source BTW. Anyway these guys did a teardown on a strong motor that went south quickly. Looks like member here Rick Seeman can maybe shed some light?? I don't know if his friend Joe is here as well?? I realized between the 10 and 11 minute marks, all the questions in my head were going to go unanswered....bummer. Anyway, good vid, good channel, good boys, good motor....would just like to know some more info.

 
If the cam was bent how did the builder rotate it with his fingers when initially built? Was top end lube checked at first prelube? Does anyone know rpm at max power?
Mike
 
What are the questions in your head? I've spent the last month working on cam/cam bearing issues. Maybe I can give you an answer. This is a cam straightening video I did recently.

And last night I pulled a new Comp Cam out of the box that I bought last month. It was bent .007" but I got it straight.
 
rickseeman said:
What are the questions in your head?
Click to expand...
Who's cam? How did it get bent? How bent? Why was it so easy to spin by hand? And why did the bearings look like they were worked on with a bearing knife in some parts of the vid, and totally new in other parts? ( maybe illusion) Great effort BTW, and thanks for stopping by to respond. :thumbsup::thumbsup: Also, is your friend Joe someone we know here at the FBBO??
 
#1 I don't remember whose cam that one was (and you know I'm not protecting anyone because I will talk bad about any cam grinder) we were working on 4 engines at that time.
#2 I assume it was bent when it was put in new. (Won't make that mistake again.) Never assume a new cam is straight. New or used.
#3 .005"
#4 I don't recall it spinning easily by hand.
#5 I thought the bearings looked great.
#6 Joe isn't on any forums.

The owner was on a short road trip when the #4 cam bearing spun 1/2". That cut off 100% of the oil to the #4 cam bearing and to the top end. The owner had no way of knowing this happened so he kept driving until the rocker arm adjusters wore out and the top end started rattling. The strange thing was, when we tore it down, the #4 cam bearing (and cam journal) looked perfect after zero oil going to it for all that time. And this was a very high lift, high spring pressure roller cam. That made no sense to me. Don't ever let anyone tell you cam bearings aren't tough.
 
What I meant is I don't recall it spinning easily by hand when it was put together. I think he put the cam in at his place. It was torn down here. I watched the video where you said and it turned easily. But I'm guessing it didn't turn that easily when it was put together. (They usually don't.) But I've never seen that lead to a problem. I've never seen one spin a cam bearing either. (It's not an LS.) We never really figured out how or why the cam bearing spun 1/2". My best guess is we can make so much power with these strokers and Trick Flow heads that now you wake up and you are making 750 HP (which is way more than 426 Hemi Pro Stockers made when they came out) and you need to look at everything with a microscope. And make it perfect. This isn't the old days of building 400 HP motors.
Joe did several follow up videos I believe, or a least segments in following videos. We tore it all the way down to a bare block and put it back together. We had to wait on Harland Sharp to inspect the rockers. He is probably going to test run it today and get it shipped back to the customer. Thankfully, the customer has been very understanding and easy to work with through all of this. This motor is why I've spent the last 30 days studying cams, cam bores, cam bearings and fixes to make it all work perfect.
 
rickseeman said:
What I meant is I don't recall it spinning easily by hand when it was put together. I think he put the cam in at his place. It was torn down here. I watched the video where you said and it turned easily. But I'm guessing it didn't turn that easily when it was put together. (They usually don't.) But I've never seen that lead to a problem. I've never seen one spin a cam bearing either. (It's not an LS.) We never really figured out how or why the cam bearing spun 1/2". My best guess is we can make so much power with these strokers and Trick Flow heads that now you wake up and you are making 750 HP (which is way more than 426 Hemi Pro Stockers made when they came out) and you need to look at everything with a microscope. And make it perfect. This isn't the old days of building 400 HP motors.
Joe did several follow up videos I believe, or a least segments in following videos. We tore it all the way down to a bare block and put it back together. We had to wait on Harland Sharp to inspect the rockers. He is probably going to test run it today and get it shipped back to the customer. Thankfully, the customer has been very understanding and easy to work with through all of this. This motor is why I've spent the last 30 days studying cams, cam bores, cam bearings and fixes to make it all work perfect.
Click to expand...
Do LS engines have a problem with spinning cam bearings?
 
Cranky said:
Do LS engines have a problem with spinning cam bearings?
Click to expand...
I don't know anything about an LS but a buddy comes by from time to time and and he says they do. And we work on his LS bearings. We glued the last set in. And I've seen LS pinning videos etc.
 
rickseeman said:
I've never seen one spin a cam bearing either. (It's not an LS.) We never really figured out how or why the cam bearing spun 1/2". My best guess is we can make so much power with these strokers and Trick Flow heads that now you wake up and you are making 750 HP (
Click to expand...
Thats why i mentioned the block itself. Cam bearings need some "crush" just like rods and mains, in their own way. Ill admit it would probably take more experience than i have to have the right feel for when its going in too easily, but its def something to watch for while putting them in. Im sure you arent wrong about the power factor either.....you are reaching the upper limits of a factory block, for sure
 
rickseeman said:
What are the questions in your head? I've spent the last month working on cam/cam bearing issues. Maybe I can give you an answer. This is a cam straightening video I did recently.

And last night I pulled a new Comp Cam out of the box that I bought last month. It was bent .007" but I got it straight.
Click to expand...


 
@ post#12..... i was thinking that i would never attempt to straighten a factory cam. And thank god ive never needed to work on a billet cam so far. You know as well as i there was "nothing wrong" with that cam till the second it hit the shop floor.
 
Lefty71 said:
@ post#12..... i was thinking that i would never attempt to straighten a factory cam. And thank god ive never needed to work on a billet cam so far. You know as well as i there was "nothing wrong" with that cam till the second it hit the shop floor.
Click to expand...

I couldn't help thinking about hammering on a cast cam. Kind of like hammering on a cast crank, you shouldn't do it. Billet cams would be a different story. I've repaired many cast items and it's a different animal. Doesn't like heat, doesn't like welding, doesn't like shock.

I guess what Rick's doing, straightened a cam by hammering on it, the material is forgiving enough that it works. I'm wondering how long the "tweaking " will last. Cast has no memory like steel.
 
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