1969 Road Runner facelift

[northerndave]

Howdy guys, it's time to break ground on my 69 roadrunner.

Maybe a little intro first.

I purchased the car late last summer, drove it for a few months and put it away for the winter.

It's a lynch road 383 car with a 4 speed. fresh air hood, power steering, tan interior, exterior originally T7 bronze with white vinyl top.

It was painted white in 76 and at that time it also got some era correct mural and funky panel color paint.

Body hasn't been touched since it got this funky paint job in 76.

(this is a photo from the ad previous to my purchase, hence the license plate black out)

Ok, so I know my trunk floor center is bad, my trunk to quarter extensions are junk, I have lower rear and forward quarter issues, and possibly some upper quarter damage on the drivers side. (now verified)

Oh, wheel house problems on the drivers side too.

I'm putting together my body parts list for Jeff at 521restorations.

With some uncertainy on the level of damage to the drivers side quarter I decided to do some bondo excavating tonight with the sander.

Bondo cracks, dead givaway... These areas I sanded are the top of the quarter on the driver's side.

That stuff is deep!

Hammer work... damn!

More!!

Then this area of interest... where the top of the quarter meets the trunk lid.

ick...

 

[northerndave]

For my list for Jeff..

I'm thinking passenger quarter skin, both trunk extensions, trunk floor, inner and outer wheel house for drivers side... probably a full quarter for drivers side, and I'm thinkin maybe a new back bumper.

 

[hunt2elk]

Well Dave since you have started a new thread just for the restoration I must ask if the exterior color has been chosen yet. I bet it is still keeping you up at night. It will look good whatever you chose.

 

[northerndave]

I should have also added in my opening post that My little project here is on a deadline, I'd like to have the car straightened out, painted and buffed in time for a small local car show we have in my area every mid June.

This year's show is June 11.

We are so very fortunate to have several unbelievable restorations being posted here and updated regularly. Those projects are far beyond where I will be going with mine.

The direction for my project is a one man fast track path back onto the road with respectable results.

I did a 65 mustang last year at this time with the same sort of timeline and the same sort of end result goals... sadly that car was wrecked and has been totaled out. Luckily nobody was hurt.

Here's a link to that project if anyone is super bored, it was a "father daughter" project.

It maybe gives an idea as to how this roadrunner project might go.

http://forums.vintage-mustang.com/vintage-mustang-forum/611813-father-daughter-coupe-project.html

 

[northerndave]

Paint color? Well.. Probably back to T7 bronze or a burnt orange metalic pearl like this..

Thats all the same paint card, different angles, lots of color flop to it.

pretty sure I'm putting a white vinyl top back on it again regardless.

 

[hunt2elk]

That will look sharp with the white top. Good choice.

 

[northerndave]

I'll have a million mopar questions along the way on this one, such as.... how do you remove the exterior sail panel vinyl top trim? :grin:

 

[Propwash]

Well great to see you over at the resto threads Dave..Knew you would make it over here with the rest of us rust addicts!

Just spent the past hour checking out your thread over at the Vintage Mustang Forums..
What a great thread! Got the daughter and the rest of the family working to put the mustang back on the road..Outstanding! Great job indeed! Nice shop by the way! Those guys over there at the VMF seem like a bunch or real decent guys. BTW...Is that a 63/64 Galaxie sitting next to that old yellow Ford truck?

Again, great to see you kicking off your resto on the bird. I'm sure your resto thread will be a great addition to the other wonderful resto threads the other FBBO guys have rolling or have completed. We'll be here rallying you on to that June 11th ETA.

As far as your Vinyl top trim, it is held on by three clips on each side. The clips look like the ones that hold your hoods front weather seal in place. Couple ways to get them out...

Go from the inside of the trunk, squeeze the two sides together with a duck bill needle nose or reg. plyers and push out of the holes...Tight squeeze back there. The other way, use a thin tapered vinyl trim removal tool, feel for or slide under the trim till adjacent to a trim clip, gently pry out.. If you want to be extra safe, pry out with a trim removal tool on each side of the clip and slowly, softly pry out.

Let the Adventure begin!!

BTW...that trunk monkey bit was friggin hilarious

 

[Donny]

I was going to jump in and say get it Media Blasted, but, saw your intent and desire to just get it ready for the show upcoming,

 

[detmatt1]

Glad to see this thread starting up. In a very strange, kind of nastalgic and small sort of way I will be sorry to see the current paint scheme go away, I'm sure I'll get over it soon so no need to worry. Love the burnt Orange/ white top combo and will look good with the tan interior, which I assume you will be keeping. Tight schedule, this will be fun to watch. Good luck with it.

 

[northerndave]

Wow 3 big hitters chime in, that's awesome. thanks for the tip on the vinyl top trim propwash.

In another life I was a double jointed, ambidextrous, 92 pound career circus contortionist. I don't have any of those physical qualities in this life but the guiding spirit remains within me, it drives me in my restoration efforts with hard to reach tasks. This of course has gotten me into several situations where the jaws of life were needed to free an appendage from some under the dashboard and long tube header exploration efforts.... But I've survived these difficult reach efforts up to this point so I'm not afraid to get all twisted up in that trunk reaching for those clips. lol!!

Yes you probably saw a 64 galaxy 500 XL in one of those photos. If I ever really get desperate for rust revival... that's my fix right there, awesome complete Z code 390 car with a toploader 4 speed... and a complete underside void where the floor once resided from the firewall to the back bumper lol!

Donny, I'd love to do the media blast thing. I'm thinking "someday" as in.... maybe I might get to retire one day and I'll be itching for that extensively thorough project like you guys are currently going after. :grin:

Detmatt1, I hear ya about the mural and funky paint, sad to see it go but it just can’t be saved, too far gone.

Yes I plan on keeping the saddle/tan interior since it’s in decent shape. Changing carpet, door panels, headliner and seat covers in one thing, fairly straight forward and probably doable for $1500-$1800? But then I still have all my soft vinyl and plastic items like seat belt sleeves, dash items, interior A-pillar trim, arm rests, the steering wheel itself.. color change actually gets kind of complicated if you look at the big picture. So I guess I’ll just stick with the brown/tan. :grin:


I have many hours ahead of me with the 8” sander in my hands pulling old paint off the road runner. I’ll be able to observe plenty of T7 bronze being exposed amongst the layers as I’m sanding. I’m going to see a lot of T7…. It will give me time to think about the color and basically what it boils down to is can I like T7? Can I like it enough for it to be on my car?

Lots of things happen during the manual labor “grunt work” portion of a body/paint revival. A person has plenty of time to think as you cover the floor with a thick layer of sanding dust making your way around these big cars with an 8” sander. You expose the metal a few square inches at a time, you expose old wounds, dings and dents, shade tree rust repair etc. You really get to know the car, it’s history reveals itself as the old layers of paint and body filler come off.

Your arms hang from your shoulders like tube socks filled with mercury… it makes it easier to decide on color when you arrive at “that place”. It’s that place where your back, your knees, shoulders and arms hurt.

Sometimes it happens when you are on your back holding the sander above your head removing old paint from the rockers or a lower quarter section.

Sometimes it happens when you are welding up inside a wheel house and a spatter of molten steel settles in between your wrist and your steel watch band and you can’t get it out until after it’s already dissipated it’s heat and burned a crater in your skin….

You’ll know when you do arrive at “that place” though, it’s the moment in the project where suddenly your thoughts are uncluttered and void of compromise and reasoning. It’s that moment when you realize this is your car, and you are going to have it your way. You suddenly realize what you want, not what you “should want” or what might hold better value. Your thinking becomes unclouded and the truth is revealed.

The moment can look something like this:

Then you stop, and you pick your color.

And all is well.
:grin:

 

[northerndave]

I could use some input on the matter of my driver’s side quarter panel.

I exposed the suspected damage to the quarter above the reach of a simple quarter repair skin. That damage is in the way of metal distortion, dents. Not rust, but old hammer work.

Which leads in to my question. For you guys that have done the full quarter replacement, I have seen your posts and I understand the full quarter task isn't without it's difficulties. I've seen you guys do thin fillets to stretch or narrow sections for alignment, crack repair where the stamping has a deep or sharp draw resulting in thin/stressed areas...

If you were in my situation with a solid yet mildly hammer distorted upper quarter area, would you rather address the old hammer work and attach a 1/4 skin? Or would you opt for a complete 1/4 and address the fit issues?

Of course take into consideration the nearly 6' long weld seam that comes with the 1/4 skin method.

Which would you consider the lesser of 2 evils?

Cost aside, we know the full 1/4 is twice the cost of a skin but disregard that factor.

Labor time, end quality and confidence in the life of the repair being the deciding factors, which way would you go?

 

[Propwash]

Wow Dave...Quite the article! Tube socks filled with mercury?? LOL! I don't know if to call you Edgar Allan Poe or Jim Morrison...Needless to say, pretty fluent in the means of comparative literacy.

I figured that was what that old red Ford was...Not much of a Oh Henry fan (nothing against them at all), but would love to have a 63/64 or a mid 50's Fairlane.

As far as the quarter issue....To be honest for what you got and after seeing Matt's issues along with the ones I've had myself, I would go with the skins. Sure you will have the long weld across to deal with, but at least you won't have to deal with tail light Buckets, trunk gutters, melting out lead at the C-pillar then grinding out welds then cutting out the spot welds in that area, deck filler to quarter, door jam to quarter, quarter to rocker transition, window corners, C-Pillar to window framing, quarter to window curve brace support, quarter tucked under to windlace rail as well as maybe all the issues Matt and I had.....Also, you'll be looking at doing a bit more bracing/alignment.

I didn't have the opportunity to go with the skins on my RR because of rot issues, but I would have if it wasn't necessary. The quarter skins on my Coronet and a past Dart took half the time as full quarters on this bird. Cost is another issue..600-700 bucks you could spend on other parts...Heck ya!

Couple routes I would go on the damage above the skin layout area. Possibly get hunks cut out of a donor car and graft in. (did the same for a section of my inner fender). Try to heat or pull out damaged areas...Lead in damaged areads...Buy a full quarter for that side and cut to create your own larger quarter skin...

Just my 2 cents buddy....

 

[northerndave]

Alright thanks man.

I notice you listed tail light bucket as well as quarter to door jam in what i might avoid by doing a skin?

I've installed skins wrapping into the door jam area and attaching to the tail pan area before. Would you advise against it for any particular reason? I could see maybe at the tail pan area to insure the best bezel fit up back there with out too much filler maybe?

I had a little too much coffee this morning and my fingers went crazy on the keyboard. It's my only explanation for where all them dang words came from lol!

 

[Propwash]

Don't get me wrong Dave, cool words in your resto skit. Pretty creative. I'm a coffee junky myself.

If the AMD skins are wrap around in those areas or other MFG's are these days, hell ya weld them in at the jams/pan. A lot easier than trying to level out and butt up along the body. I imagine AMD's skins are just a cut down version of their full quarter stamp. As far as the bucket to quarter mate up back there, the full quarters lined pretty good. There definitely was some finessing to get the tail light extensions to fit up right from the side and straight on.

 

[northerndave]

Oh aint there always a little fit up work with tail light and headlight bezels on all old cars? :grin:

I did skins on a 68 coronet not too long ago and they wrapped front and back edge. Hell they even reached about half way to the sail panel and trunk lid above the top body line... hmmm...

Skins are sounding better all the time.

:grin:

 

[northerndave]

hmmm, I wonder if full quarters take 2 tooling hits as apposed to maybe one hit for a skin?

would explain a lot of the cost diff..

maybe?

 

[Propwash]

When I did the skins on the Coronet back 10 years ago..Whoa! I'm getting friggin old!! Reality check! Anyways, they did not wrap around. I also had to graft in the old side marker light area because the new one was about 2 inches off. you're right they are getting better..

Did a set on a 67 GTO last summer and the lip up by the jam was there, but in the back there wasn't a lip, just 2" of extra metal.

Could be on the toolings Dave...God knows there really isn't that much more metal on a full vs. skin

Welder47 (russ) on here was selling a set of 69' skins. Wonder if he still has them and could possibly measure the top lip for ya. Maybe even sell them to ya for that matter. Real decent guy. Wisconsin fella as well-not too far from you.

 

[northerndave]

Interesting, I might have to look him up.

I have read about and seen pictures of projects where the original marker lights have been retained or transfered to the new skin in the correct location so I will be watching for that for sure.

Thanks for the tip on the skins, I'll do a member search for welder47

 

[roadrunnerman]

just to chime in,i would agree with matt on the old paint scheme, i would hate to see it go,but that was in the "hippie" days.i think the color you are going to put on the car now will make that car a headturner at any carshow or on the street.