440 HP cam shaft specs

[junkpile]

Does anyone have the Cam specs for a 440 HP motor. I have a 78 440 block .030 with stock 69 heads and a 484/284 cam. I have been having nothing but problems with WOT bog and stall. I have a new vacuum advance distributor, 13 degree base with 37 total. eddy 750. runs great in traffic and on open road. AT 45mph if you stab it, it will pull hard all the way above 100.

BUTTTT if you are at a standing start, and hit it for spirited acceleration or WOT it will bog or stall out in any gear (727 automatic, 2800 stall, 3:23 gear) I have posted my problems before and have tried every piece of advice. I had a bad distributor so I changed it out, the new one is set for my cam but it did not come with the adjuster for the vacuum advance ( I though it did, my last distributor did) so I will have to order a new Distributor.

I am so frustrated buy this problem for the last few years that I hate the motor. I have limited funds for the car but I think changed to a more stock cam will solve my problems. I would love to not open up the motor but I don't know any other options. I was told to disconnect my vacuum advance and try to run it and see what it does. I have not had the chance to try that yet. but what would that do and how would I need to change timing? I just don't understand how this thing can run so normal in every situation and fall on its face when you NEED to get it going.

 

[junkpile]

just FYI

I am trying to find the specs for a cam that will give performance without the issues of the 484/284. something between stock and mine or the specs for a 44 HP motor. I cant seem to find any stock specifications. If I cant get my setup to work it will be my only way to go. but will take some time to do.

 

[Bill Monk]

I run that cam in a 440 and except for really low vacuum, I like it and I have no problems like what you are describing. A 750 edlebrock afb has little options to tune how quick the secondaries open and I don't care for it for that reason. Carter realized the problem back in the day and that's when they came out with the avs and then thermo quad. Before we go scrapping the carb though, is your vacuum advance hooked to ported or manifold vacuum?

 

[junkpile]

manifold vacuum. the right side of the carb lower port.

 

[Bill Monk]

manifold vacuum. the right side of the carb lower port.

so what is your timing with the advance connected at idle?

 

[Bill Monk]

By the way, I don't think anybody is grinding the original cam but from what I understand, this is close.
https://www.summitracing.com/parts/DCC-4452783AE/

 

[junkpile]

a friend of mine cam to set the timing, its was at 13 initial but I am not sure with the advance on. I will have to check it and get back with you.

I have used this cam for 15 years but the past 4 have been hell. I used to burn the tires off the thing but it always ran so rich you could not breath in the car, I put a new eddy 750 in and it ran better with bog that I have been chasing. finally found the distributor had a shaft bearing tha was causing it to rise up and jamb the rotor against the cap. Prior to that I was getting close to eliminating the bog issue but never could get it to go away, now its worse, before at least in 2nd it would take off with a minor bog (would bog hard in drive) now I got nothing.

the Eddy is a 750 with .110 jets, 070 x 037 metering rods (from Smitty Smith with edelbrock, he is their mopar guy) and pink step up springs. works great except for the bog that will get me killed pulling into traffic here in the Atlanta area.

 

[junkpile]

thanks for the cam lead. I greatly appreciate it.

 

[Bill Monk]

Get back to me with what the timing is at idle with the vacuum advance connected

 

[YY1]

do you have enough accelerator pump shot?

are we sure the pump is actually working?

on my 318, the first adjustment hole causes exactly what you are describing, the second cures it.

 

[junkpile]

The accelerator pump shot is thru 043 squirters, and is in the position closest to the carb body to get the maximum shot. I have checked it and it is flowing when opening the throttle all the way.

 

[Lefty71]

Start with the basics of motor integrity.... Compression checks, and look at all 8 to make sure there is no valve issue. I would be willing to bet you would love that cam in a well working engine. My two cents (without knowing more about your specifics) is the spark isn't as good as you think, meaning a MSD setup will blow you away compared to stock performance. However, I think the pump shot is the real culprit, meaning no matter how good it LOOKS, its leaving you with unburnt fuel and a crapload of air at the wrong time, when you need a properly atomized combination. (MSD and Dbl. pumper = problem solved). HTH. Lefty71

 

[junkpile]

ok just did a quick timing check for you

base with vacuum hooked up, after warming up is 30 although it did sit at 18 for a short time

10 with vacuum capped off at 800 rpm 7" vacuum

with vacuum hooked up idle in park is 1050-1100 rpm, in gear its at 900 rpm car loves it there anything under 800 is runs rough and will stall out.

its starting to rain so I could not test WOT with vacuum capped but I would have to turn up the idle as it dips to 600 or less in gear with the line capped. that mean it will quit.

any ideas or info let me know, I need to try something. would love to keep the vacuum hooked up but if I cant I cant.

 

[oldbee]

I think I would look real hard for a vacuum leak somewhere. Timing at idle w/o vac. line hooked up? 36-38 at 3000 w/o vac. With vacuum you’ll probably see about 45-50; that’s ok because just cruising along. Let us know.

 

[PurpleBeeper]

These guys are giving you some really good advice. Super duper check for vacuum leaks. You may have to give up the vacuum advance & run a touch more initial timing? Maybe 12-15 initial and possibly limit the total to 36'ish? Just see what your motor likes & you are on the right track.

IF there are no vacuum leaks (very possible you have one), then "in general" a bog from a dead stop is either A)not enough squirt or B)secondaries opening too fast. Basically, too much air and/or too little fuel.

However, since your car seems to run OK at cruise & higher rpm's, that is sounding like a vacuum leak. When your engine is already flowing a lot of air (higher rpm), then a vacuum leak (extra air) isn't nearly as big a problem (it's a small percentage of the total air flowing). At low rpm (not much air flowing through the engine) a vacuum leak is a much bigger percentage of your air flow....the air/fuel mixture gets way off & the engine misfires.
1. check for vacuum leaks
2. set your timing again (try a few different settings with & without vacuum advance)
3. see if you can get your idle fuel mixture set a little closer so you can turn the idle screw down while keeping the idle up...basically maximizing your idle vacuum.
4. see what you get & report back to these guy on FBBO. There's a ton of very helpful people here with several experts in various areas.... very helpful. Bill is very knowledgeable & both YY1 and Oldbee have helped me personally several times.... and there's more where these guys came from on this board!

 

[junkpile]

thanks for that Purple Beeper. I will get brake cleaner and check for vacuum leaks hopefully by Thursday. I will let you know what I find. if I don't find a leak I will start by trying capping vacuum and up the timing to 13 and give it a shot.

 

[Bill Monk]

thanks for that Purple Beeper. I will get brake cleaner and check for vacuum leaks hopefully by Thursday. I will let you know what I find. if I don't find a leak I will start by trying capping vacuum and up the timing to 13 and give it a shot.

propane is better at checking for leaks, it won't damage your paint

 

[Bill Monk]

These guys are giving you some really good advice. Super duper check for vacuum leaks. You may have to give up the vacuum advance & run a touch more initial timing? Maybe 12-15 initial and possibly limit the total to 36'ish? Just see what your motor likes & you are on the right track.

IF there are no vacuum leaks (very possible you have one), then "in general" a bog from a dead stop is either A)not enough squirt or B)secondaries opening too fast. Basically, too much air and/or too little fuel.

However, since your car seems to run OK at cruise & higher rpm's, that is sounding like a vacuum leak. When your engine is already flowing a lot of air (higher rpm), then a vacuum leak (extra air) isn't nearly as big a problem (it's a small percentage of the total air flowing). At low rpm (not much air flowing through the engine) a vacuum leak is a much bigger percentage of your air flow....the air/fuel mixture gets way off & the engine misfires.
1. check for vacuum leaks
2. set your timing again (try a few different settings with & without vacuum advance)
3. see if you can get your idle fuel mixture set a little closer so you can turn the idle screw down while keeping the idle up...basically maximizing your idle vacuum.
4. see what you get & report back to these guy on FBBO. There's a ton of very helpful people here with several experts in various areas.... very helpful. Bill is very knowledgeable & both YY1 and Oldbee have helped me personally several times.... and there's more where these guys came from on this board!

Good advise here from beeper as well. If you use a vacuum gauge when you set your timing, it will tell you what your particular engine likes. Advance until you get the highest vacuum reading and no more. That should put you where you want to be but absolutely rule out that vacuum leak first.

 

[dvw]

a friend of mine cam to set the timing, its was at 13 initial but I am not sure with the advance on. I will have to check it and get back with you.

I have used this cam for 15 years but the past 4 have been hell. I put a new eddy 750 in and it ran better with bog that I have been chasing. finally found the distributor had a shaft bearing tha was causing it to rise up and jamb the rotor against the cap. Prior to that I was getting close to eliminating the bog issue but never could get it to go away.

You are answering part of your own question.
Same cam 15 years, ran fine for 11.
Different carb helped.
New distributor made it worse.
The cam won't make it bog, lazy maybe. Where are the floats set at? Some 750 Eddys have issues jets won't cure. Could be a blocked idle feed, too large an air bleed, etc. If you give it 20 degrees intial what does it do? Check on tip in only as it will have excessive advance at speed.
Doug

 

[junkpile]

sorry I have not gotten back to you guys. I have not had a chance to get to the car due to really bad weather and overall schedule. I will let you know how my leak test goes as soon as I can.