As Teslas age

[That_Tall_Dude]

Not a fan of musk; too much hype, spin, and bs.

Really glad to see this sort of thing.

Test drove a electric car in 2014; it was great.

Ask what it would cost to replace the battery after the warranty; sales guy was no help, so went and talked to the mechanics.

They had just saw warranty replacement for another brand; was $20k or $25k

was like nope, this isn’t ready for my type; I’ll wait.

let all the snobby first-with-everything folks do the beta testing like I do with most things

Will get the nice thing after the hype is gone, and the product is better, more practical & cheaper

 

[zyzzyx]

When you go off the grid, you put up your portable solar panels and charge the batteries!
Just like bringing extra gas, except it's free from the Sun. Everything is not perfect, but we
can plan around it.

 

[That_Tall_Dude]

The thing about electric cars that keeps preying on my mind is...I can fill up my truck/jeep/or whatever with fuel, take along some extra gas cans and disappear in the desert or mountains for days....

Can you take a charging station with you? Extra pre-charged batteries? I don't think so Tim.

I feel like that will severely limit my (and many others') personal freedom to spend quality time in the more desolate and unpopulated areas that our nation is so rich with.

Maybe that's what they want?....

actually I’m kinda interested in that; for the electric pick-ups

tow a camper trailer with PV on top 3 deep

2 pop out on either side for shade

Stay out as long as you want...

so like 24 ft x 20 ft array

 

[BeepBeepRR]

Here ya go Fossil Fuels to the rescue.

 

[sam dupont]

Chrysler made EV cars in the early 80's. Hemmings did a write up at the time. Omni's and Horizons that were said to go 65 MPH for one hour. That would be okay for a drive to work car, but for traveling, they had a 5 horse generator on a trailer to tow behind. Those generators generally use a gallon per hour, so that would be 65 mpg. Chrysler claimed that charged from the wall, the cost was the equivalent of 200 mpg in gasoline.

 

[Photon440]

Tesla finally made money. Selling Credits, not Cars. I hope Tesla succeeds. On their OWN. As said, Henry Ford made it on his own. Without tax credits and taxpayers floating the company. It’s called the American Way. Capitalism. Supply and demand. Musk is a smart guy. Hero, walks on water? Nah.

Well, Henry Ford didn't really make it on his own. He lost his first two car companies and the Dodge brothers were the reason his third attempt worked.

By the way, I saw a 2009 Chrysler Aspen Hybrid today, took me by surprise as they only made them for a few months before axing the line. I wonder how the battery is now? It looked very clean.

 

[Cojohnso1]

First....with no engine oil or transmission oil, of COURSE it will be clean. No surprise there.
Secondly....Musk is successful at what cost? Did WPC take federal money? Did Ford or GM get subsidies? Did their buyers get tax credits for buying the cars?
No.
Musk has skills but the biggest one is that he has conned the Feds into paying for and supporting HIS dream.

Tesla could refab their entire operation many times over with the fed dollars the bid 3 got thru the years. Plenty with their hands out. Of course electric is going to win. They damn near won 100+ years ago. They outperform at the same time more efficient. Overall maintenance cost is better. And thats today? What will it be in 5 years? Far superior. The truth? The truth is internal combustion engines have been obsolete for decades. Research some of the new battery technologies? Lithium will be obsolete very likely in our lifetime. Batteries that can charge in the matter of minutes. While provide 1000+ mile range.

We can either lead the next generation of transportation technology? Or watch China and Germany eat our lunch.

 

[moparedtn]

Well, Henry Ford didn't really make it on his own. He lost his first two car companies and the Dodge brothers were the reason his third attempt worked.

Ah, but were the Dodge brothers from the government or did Ford hire them himself?
The point is valid - Ford was a private sector success eventually....and created an entire industry
of which the entire world still benefits to this day.

 

[dodgedifferent2]

I dont know enough about Tesla and electric cars.
However,

I am on a road trip to visit the inlaws who are 8 hr drive away. When i get low on gas i stop and fill up and back on road in 10-15 min.
Now with battery. How long would i have to sit while battery charges before i can continue the trip?

 

[F4R/T]

I agree Musk got the feds to find his dream and he still hasn’t paid the tax payers back in full and is dragging it on and on while his stock soars in value and dividends are paid out... no joke!
I see no need for electric cars I think they are a joke. Trains, trolleys and mass transit are key but keeping the SAFE is key, IMO our forefathers had it figured out what works. Trolleys / cable cars work well but getting folk to use them is a problem. Just don’t force them on me if that’s what you want go for it but I still will have my dinosaur.. And have something that lives and breathes and has feeling to it..

 

[Volksnut]

I have 8 year old Milwaukee M18 battery drills and still use the original batteries. No problems with them.

You are absolutely correct, I have those at home and all good so far. At work I have Ridgid and Dewalt.

 

[That_Tall_Dude]

I dont know enough about Tesla and electric cars.
However,

I am on a road trip to visit the inlaws who are 8 hr drive away. When i get low on gas i stop and fill up and back on road in 10-15 min.
Now with battery. How long would i have to sit while battery charges before i can continue the trip?

Really like this guys you tube page; lots of interesting stuff

he’s a car nut; gas or electric, this one is on winter charging:



(most of his stuff is gas engines, but has some electric car stuff)

 

[That_Tall_Dude]

That last video has kind of a positive perspective on charging; this one talks about more of the issues.

he’s an engineer and likes solvable problems, so talks about them with optimism.

this is where things will get messy with electric cars (about 1/2 through the video):

 

[That_Tall_Dude]

I agree Musk got the feds to find his dream and he still hasn’t paid the tax payers back in full and is dragging it on and on while his stock soars in value and dividends are paid out... no joke!
I see no need for electric cars I think they are a joke. Trains, trolleys and mass transit are key but keeping the SAFE is key, IMO our forefathers had it figured out what works. Trolleys / cable cars work well but getting folk to use them is a problem. Just don’t force them on me if that’s what you want go for it but I still will have my dinosaur.. And have something that lives and breathes and has feeling to it..

Hasn’t government has wanted non-emissions vehicles (like electric or equivalent) for highly populated areas for decades?

All the lost productivity and cost, from health problems from emissions right?

think musk took it on, and tried to make it cool; ie desirable.

He succeeded with that, just would be nice if he wasn’t such an *** about it

 

[zyzzyx]

Can the grid handle EV's? Hell yeah! The software programs them to charge in the
wee hours of the night when most industry and businesses are not operating and
the rates are lower. They have power plants that are specifically designed to start
up and generate power when the load increases. They're called "Peakers". When
the guys get into work in the morning and start to turn on lights and machinery,
these units start to roll and make as much power as needed. And then there's the
Nukes!

 

[Richard Cranium]

Really like this guys you tube page; lots of interesting stuff

he’s a car nut; gas or electric, this one is on winter charging:



(most of his stuff is gas engines, but has some electric car stuff)

Listening to this guy yammer on for a the full length of the video will put you to sleep. 8 hours of charge time to drive 2,000 miles & you either sit in the car all that time or go inside the rest area and eat crappy rest area food. He says that all of the Tesla chargers are located on or just off the highway, but if you're driving off the beaten path, that's probably going to be an issue. Figuring out the battery life left & where the next charging station is will add to the stress of driving.

In comparison, my F150 which has a 700 mile cruise range with its 36 gallon gas tank. It takes me about 13 minutes to fill up when empty, so I'm looking at a little over a half an hour of fill time in 2,000 miles. If I were to take my wife's car on the same 2,000 mile trip, with it's 18.5 gallon gas tank and getting 28 mpg, I've got a 500 mile cruise range. Four 7 minute fill ups = 28 minutes fill time. When on a road trip & it's time to find a place to eat, I'll pull off the highway and find a decent restaurant versus eating at crappy highway rest stop waiting for my car to charge.

8 hours fill time for the Tesla = funk that.

 

[Richard Cranium]

he’s an engineer

That explains his non-stop yammering.

 

[dadsbee]

 

[That_Tall_Dude]

View attachment 1100715

This meme is much better than that stupid tow battery meme charging a car that says the battery is a diesel generator

But it got me wondering how the fuel economy actually compares...

diesels are highly efficient... electric cars are extremely efficient

wouldn’t it be ironic if somebody charging with a diesel generator still beat out ice cars & trucks on fuel consumption

apparently an electric car charged on a diesel generator uses less fuel than an equivalent diesel car

not by much, but hey, that is wild

Probably the regenerative braking outweighs the charging losses

This meme is actually a promotion for electric car’s exceptional fuel economy

“even doing something this stupid, like charging via diesel generator constantly, is still more fuel efficient than ice vehicles”

thanks for posting that here; I wouldn’t have checked it out or commented on it otherwise

 

[Photon440]

look at the Government Motors Volt being pushed by the 'Anointed One'
a perfect example of huge waste, picking bad stuff, not yet proven tech.
or the fed. govt. getting involved

I'm not sure who the 'Anointed One' is, but the Volt was a pet project of Bob Lutz, the same guy who gave us the Viper.

As for moving money around, Chrysler could have done the same thing. They chose to remain less profitable instead of building electric cars.

Every car company gets subsidies and loans, Tesla less than most of the rest. And they've paid back what they owe, ahead of schedule. Tesla had over 100 subsidies with a total subsidy value of $2,441,582,590. Meanwhile...as of last summer (2020) and taxpayers money:

• Ford borrowed $5.937 billion under the ATVM Loan Program. Ford still hasn’t paid that back.
  • As of today, Ford has had a total of at least $33,489,841,570 ($33.49 billion) in subsidies awarded.
• Nissan borrowed $1.448 billion under the ATVM Loan Program and still hasn’t paid us back.
  • Nissan’s total subsidy value is $1,955,199,450 ($1.96 billion).
• Fisker Automotive borrowed $529 million under the ATVM Loan Program and went bankrupt. We won’t get that money back.
• GM and Chrysler both went into bankruptcy and had to be rescued under a separate program.
  • GM’s total subsidy value is $50,346,920,000 ($50.35 billion).
  • Fiat-Chrysler’s total subsidy value is $17,599,200,000 ($17.6 billion).