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To spot or to mig that is the question.

The Dude

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Question for the metal workers out there, I’m pretty proficient with plug welding with my mig but when replacing a roof it can get a bit tedious. I’m wondering if anyone has worked with a lenco spot welder or any variant of spot welder vs. mig plug welding? I can get a deal right now for a lenco L4000 for 300$ and am wondering if i should grab it and go with that for roof replacement on my 69 charger. Any help/advice would be appreciated.
 
Dude,

I'm not familiar with the lenco, but if you can find a spot welder that creates the 5/16" spot welds like the factory, jump on it. Sure beats the hell out of grinding down and smoothing over MIG welds.

I've seen those ebay cheapy's with 1/8" spot, really come back and bite people in the rear. Stay away from anything close to that size....

Good luck to ya
 
well it comes with a box of misc. tips but i can get a set that includes 5/16 as well as a gammit of other tips with a very cool drip rail tip as well for 65$.
 
If you have your heat and wire speed right, you shouldn't have much of a spot to grind...jmo...and I agree with Propwash on the spot welder. Jump on it if it's the better spot weld machine.
 
We usually use them for pulling dents.We use the prospot for spot welding.They have an attachment for the L4000 for spot welding L950 unispot.It is a clamp with two electrodes to squeeze the panel as it welds,it is a must have.For $300 buy it if it works and is clean.It can be used to pull dents,heat shrink,single side spot weld,and spot weld.The attachments can get expensive if not included in the deal.$550 for the L950 for squeeze type spot welding.If you want to save yourself alot of headache bond the roof skin on.Use 3M 8116 to bond the roof skin on and 3M 8360 ultra pro urethane seam sealer on the roof bows.Then mig weld the rest at the a pillars and the sail panels glue everything else.Have used this product in this manor since the late 80"s with no problems.It will take one tube of 8116 at roughly $40 and one tube of 8360 at roughly $20.Then buy one tube of 3M 8308 heavy bodied self leveling seam sealer for your drip edge after bonding.It is roughly $30,you will have to purchase cartridge gun for about $25.With all of this you can have the roof skin on and finished for less than $150.I would be more than happy to walk you through it if need.
 
Thanks for the info, it dosent come with the c clamp but im still tempted to buy it just to learn it. i will definatly hit you up with a pm later this week with questions about the bonding material. thanks again for the input everyone.
 
If you plan on doing another car or your own body repairs buy it.I have a LC1000 and have used it for 12 years in the production world with no problems.
 
Have you considered using adhesive ? I was reluctant a few years ago to change over, but after using it on qtrs (I used Fusor), I would use it anytime. Being skeptical at first, I was convinced. you'll only have to do minimal Mig
 
bought it for 275$, will do a mini review when i get some time in on it, ill do some before and afters as well. i couldent pass it up after he went down 25$ even tho i was ready to pay 300..... but his loss my gain. thanks everyone for the input and im still intrested about the bonding just to add more knoledge to my "to try" list.
 
The adhesive route sounds interesting. I wonder what sort of surface prep you have to do for it to work properly.
 
I used adhesive to bond my upper cowl and the prep for it was basically the same as if it were being migged. I figured this was the ideal place for it as it acted as a seal for the plenum and I also had fresh body color on the top of the lower cowl and didn't want to risk sparks dancing around on it.
I bought a Lenco dual spot welder last year from a Craigslist ad, thing is like brand new and worked well when I tried it before I loaded it in my truck. Haven't used since I brought it home! I will though, probably when I start on the Challenger.
 
I use a miller spot welder alot but they are limited to being able to reach into the welding area, it does a wide weld but you really got to watch the amount of time you hold the power on button. Just to P you off I got mine brand new from a guy on craigslist that didnt know how to use it right for 75.00 lol and it the best one of that type Miller makes. Just got lucky on finding it.
 
Spot welders need quick rise time on amperage. Cheap machines just5 don't get it done. A real spot welder found in a assembly plant is mega bucks. Learn to improve your skills and either plug with a mig or learn to tig. If you tig then your metal fuses together easier and very little grinding after.
 
Spot welders need quick rise time on amperage. Cheap machines just5 don't get it done. A real spot welder found in a assembly plant is mega bucks. Learn to improve your skills and either plug with a mig or learn to tig. If you tig then your metal fuses together easier and very little grinding after.

i totally agree
a spot welder to do the job properly is big bucks
also the electric to run it isn't something you wouldn't get out of your plug in the wall either.
the lenco and other units from what i have seen in the past
leave me with doubts of good weld penetration
that i don't have using a mig...

as for bonding,it has its place in new cars for sure
for old ones,if i saw a bonded panel on it
when its for sale i would keep a walking
just like if it had frame caps....
 
Absolutely nothing wrong with using panel bonding adhesives and I would absolutely use it when putting on a roof skin.
 
Absolutely nothing wrong with using panel bonding adhesives and I would absolutely use it when putting on a roof skin.

imo
there is something wrong...
the overlap left with bonding is not acceptable to me for a proper repair on our old cars
if someone welded in a panel the same way
i wouldn't like it much either....
 
imo
there is something wrong...
the overlap left with bonding is not acceptable to me for a proper repair on our old cars
if someone welded in a panel the same way
i wouldn't like it much either....

Not sure what you mean by overlap but I'm interested.
 
Not sure what you mean by overlap but I'm interested.

unless i'm wrong? or you educate me then...
are we just talking about bonding the skin to the frame?
or bonding the whole panel in?

you cannot bond panels end to end like butt welding does.
you leave a overlapping seam somewhere..
that seam is not acceptable to me as being proper..
you might be able to snake a use or 2 without overlap
but welding for me is the way to go.
how would you use bonding doing this repair?
017-3.jpg

068.jpg
 
unless i'm wrong? or you educate me then...
are we just talking about bonding the skin to the frame?
or bonding the whole panel in?

you cannot bond panels end to end like butt welding does.
you leave a overlapping seam somewhere..
that seam is not acceptable to me as being proper..
you might be able to snake a use or 2 without overlap
but welding for me is the way to go.
how would you use bonding doing this repair?

Most cars now a days have panels that are adhesive bonded, including quarter panels. The stuff 3M, SEM and other higher end MFG's make is tough as nails. I've seen it in action. Go online and google/you tube 3M's. The metal tears before the bond does. If it didn't work, no one would buy it, the federal government wouldn't allow it, and they wouldn't sell it. Automotive sheetmetal is flimsy stuff compared to the rest of the metal working world.

As far as overlaps, its a very common technique in modern day and old school auto body. Yes, a butt weld senario is not warranted, but adhesives have adavantages vs. welding. 1st is saving time, second it filling the gap on an overlap, 3rd requires less work and or training to accomplish.

As far as your dogleg repair on that fender, measure the patch area, use a flange gun to create the step offset so the repair patch will sit flush, trim the repair patch to fit if needed, apply the adhesive, secure in place and let cure.

Myself, I stick with the welding as well because that's what I was brought up on. Buttweld whenever possible. Overlaping can create air gaps on the backside that need to be sealed, but so can just laying a panel over another and plug welding like a quarter to trunk gutter or floor pan to crossmember if the panels are not perfectly pressed tight against each other. Matt brought up a roof...obviously the roof is layed over the inner structure. It needs to be bonded all around the window frames, across the pillars and along the rail gutters. You can drill all the holes, pull the panel to the frame as well as possible and weld and hope there isn't too many gaps in between the inner/outer and then proceed to grind down a bazillion plug welds. Or, you can lay the adhesive, secure the roof and any gap is eliminated by the adhesive....Walla

Just because the panel bonding is a newer technolgy and they didn't do it back then (it didn't exist), doesn't mean it doesn't work as well and can't apply to our cars. Welding and adhesives both have there pro's and con's.

BTW...nice work on that fender!
 
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