Valve lash / head gasket etc.

[Moparjack 489]

Hi guys, sorry as a engine rookie I have some maybe stupid questions

Engine is a 426 gen. 2 Hemi with actual 489cui ,( first over bore ) mopar mega block ( cast iron ) with Keith black billet crankshaft , mopars performance aluminum heads ( full ported)
Oliver rods
Ross piston ( compression ratio 11,34:1)
Solid lifter with a roller cam ( 4343-10)
and roller rockers ( Norris / Indy )
Intake Indy mod man with 2 x750 AFB EDE carbs
Head gasket is a 1106 from Felpro

First question: After first engine running felpro recommend to re-torque this head gaskets ?

second question : the valve lash written on the cam card everytime talk about “ warm” engine , right ? if on cold you must add something , right ?

And I have to add also something because I have a cast iron short block and aluminum heads , or just what shows on the cam card ?

Third question: for what are the “ notches “ in the cylinder bore “ on my short block ? And have this done after it comes from the factory by the engine builder, or is this notches make by the factory ?

Many thanks in advance , I a complete engine rookie but want to learn and understand something .

 

[Bad B-rad]

IMO:
If fel pro recommends retorqueing the heads, after the first run, I would do it.
Better SAFE, then sorry. After the first (or a few ) heat cycles, MAYBE things can get out of wack.

Same for setting valve lash, if they give you specs to set when warm, then that is how they assure the correct settings, and how I would do it.
I have NEVER owned a Gen 2 Hemi, so perhaps some guys can give you a spec to adjust it cold, but it will most likely be a spec to get it safely running and warmed up, to allow the final WARM setting.

I am gonna guess the notches on top of cylinder bore is for valve clearance.

 

[dvw]

Head gaskets should he fine. Start by setting the intake lash .015" and exhaust lash .012" when the engine is cold (overnight after running). Then check a few (3 of each) intake and exhaust while its hot. The exhaust will cool very quickly and change dimension. Write the lash numbers down on the valves you checked. Then after an over night sit, recheck them cold. Now you know the amount of lash change cold to hot. The numbers I gave you should be very close. Check the exhaust when the intake starts to close. Check the intake when the exhaust starts to open. Easy to bump with a starter switch connected between the positive battery post and the yellow starter solenoid wire.
Doug

 

[beanhead]

First question: After first engine running felpro recommend to re-torque this head gaskets ?

Yes re-torquing the head gaskets is good practice. It's kind of a pain, at least on the wedge engines due to the headers covering the outer bolts, but I like to do it even with the "Permatorque" gaskets that say re-torquing is not necessary.

second question : the valve lash written on the cam card everytime talk about “ warm” engine , right ? if on cold you must add something , right ?

And I have to add also something because I have a cast iron short block and aluminum heads , or just what shows on the cam card ?

Card specs are for hot lash, you're correct. If lashing cold you need to subtract lash (less clearance) as the lash will open up as the parts expand with heat. Aluminum likes to loosen the lash .004"-006" as it heats up. Again--this is wedge motor stuff, so maybe the number will vary on the hemi, but regardless--cold lash number is smaller.

Third question: for what are the “ notches “ in the cylinder bore “ on my short block ? And have this done after it comes from the factory by the engine builder, or is this notches make by the factory ?

Are you talking about the chamfered edge around the cylinder bores? If so, that's usually done at the factory to help the pistons slide in easier without ring damage. Some blocks have more than others. Some have more on one bank the other bank, too..if those are notches at the top (tough to tell on my screen) it could have been by anyone, for some valve clearance.

 

[Bad B-rad]

Sorry Mopar Jack 489, I forgot to mention what a BEAUTIFUL engine you have!!!
Best of luck with it!!!!

 

[Bad B-rad]

I think the notch he is talking about is at the 12 o clock position in the cylinder bore, it looks to be covered up by head gasket, in his photo.

MoparJack 489, can you post a few photos of the deck with out the head gasket in place?

 

[68Moparmaniac]

The notch is for the intake valve clearance. I think beanhead is mistaken, the rocker arm to valve stem clearances increase when it cools and tightens up when it gets hot hence valve clatter with a solid lift cam before the temps and oil pressure come up.

 

[glorydays]

those 1106 don't line up for shite. check your pushrod holes they overlap which could cause leak and also scuffing of the pushrods... the water port in the front can cause a leak also.... the rocker stand holes overlap a bit and caused the gasket to pucker as well... on the first two holes.. good luck. i switched to 'best' and no problems since... just an fyi. your mileage may vary...

 

[Moparjack 489]

those 1106 don't line up for shite. check your pushrod holes they overlap which could cause leak and also scuffing of the pushrods... the water port in the front can cause a leak also.... the rocker stand holes overlap a bit and caused the gasket to pucker as well... on the first two holes.. good luck. i switched to 'best' and no problems since... just an fyi. your mileage may vary...

You mean the head gasket are “ **** “ have to use a better one ? What you recommend ?

 

[Moparjack 489]

The notch is for the intake valve clearance. I think beanhead is mistaken, the rocker arm to valve stem clearances increase when it cools and tightens up when it gets hot hence valve clatter with a solid lift cam before the temps and oil pressure come up.

Yes, I think too in cold may you have add some clearance , because is hot the clearance goes less

 

[Moparjack 489]

I think the notch he is talking about is at the 12 o clock position in the cylinder bore, it looks to be covered up by head gasket, in his photo.

MoparJack 489, can you post a few photos of the deck with out the head gasket in place?

I will do tomorrow , but I think the guys a right and the notches for intake valve clearance

 

[beanhead]

The notch is for the intake valve clearance. I think beanhead is mistaken, the rocker arm to valve stem clearances increase when it cools and tightens up when it gets hot hence valve clatter with a solid lift cam before the temps and oil pressure come up.

Sorry, that's incorrect. I've always found valve lash increases with heat expansion, with aluminum heads on an iron block as the OP has. The shaft pedestals expand and move the shafts away from the camshaft creating more lash clearance. That's why cold lash specs are always tighter than hot specs not the other way around...but don't take my word for it.
Post #18-
https://www.forbbodiesonly.com/moparforum/threads/valve-lash-questions.130657/#post-910672468
I could post stuff all day from people much smarter than I, but as far as I'm concerned If IQ52/Jim Laroy said it, 'nuff said

 

[Moparjack 489]

Head gaskets should he fine. Start by setting the intake lash .015" and exhaust lash .012" when the engine is cold (overnight after running). Then check a few (3 of each) intake and exhaust while its hot. The exhaust will cool very quickly and change dimension. Write the lash numbers down on the valves you checked. Then after an over night sit, recheck them cold. Now you know the amount of lash change cold to hot. The numbers I gave you should be very close. Check the exhaust when the intake starts to close. Check the intake when the exhaust starts to open. Easy to bump with a starter switch connected between the positive battery post and the yellow starter solenoid wire.
Doug

Ok, thank you very much . If I understand you right , and you set valve lash cold first you subtract .003 from intake and exhaust from the cam card . My cam card says .018 intake and .015 exhaust ( hot)

I not understand because I think if I check it cold I think I must add some valve lash , not subtract ?

and what about the cam card , ok everybody say that’s the numbers for “ hot” check !
But what’s about cast iron and aluminum ?

the cam card ist just for cast iron block and cast iron heads ?

And if you have like me a cast iron block but Aluminium heads you have to add or subtract something ?

 

[Moparjack 489]

Sorry, that's incorrect. I've always found valve lash increases with heat expansion, with aluminum heads on an iron block as the OP has. The shaft pedestals expand and move the shafts away from the camshaft creating more lash clearance. That's why cold lash specs are always tighter than hot specs not the other way around...but don't take my word for it.
Post #18-
https://www.forbbodiesonly.com/moparforum/threads/valve-lash-questions.130657/#post-910672468
I could post stuff all day from people much smarter than I, but as far as I'm concerned If IQ52/Jim Laroy said it, 'nuff said

Thank you very much , very interesting . And it’s also that’s what dvw says , he Substract my cam card advice , because I have a cast iron block and Aluminium heads , means if they go hot the lash goes tighter then cold , right ?

 

[beanhead]

Ok, thank you very much . If I understand you right , and you set valve lash cold first you subtract .003 from intake and exhaust from the cam card . My cam card says .018 intake and .015 exhaust ( hot)

I not understand because I think if I check it cold I think I must add some valve lash , not subtract ?

and what about the cam card , ok everybody say that’s the numbers for “ hot” check !
But what’s about cast iron and aluminum ?

the cam card ist just for cast iron block and cast iron heads ?

And if you have like me a cast iron block but Aluminium heads you have to add or subtract something ?

That hot lash spec is determined (recommended) by the cam designer based on the ramps and whatever voodoo dance they do when they design it. With aluminum heads, on an iron block, start your cold lash .003 tighter--so .015 intake--just as DVW suggested. This will get you close to the cam card spec when hot.
The thing with hot checking, is things begin cooling quickly so only check a couple valves on one side, immediately after running and note the lash. If it's not quite where you'd like it, wait until the next morning when it's good and cooled, then adjust to make up the difference. So for example--if your hot reading was .020, and you wanted .018, go another .002 tighter on the cold lash. If you try to adjust them all to hot spec after running, by the time you work your way around the engine they will all be a little different due to things cooling off.

 

[Moparjack 489]

That hot lash spec is determined (recommended) by the cam designer based on the ramps and whatever voodoo dance they do when they design it. With aluminum heads, on an iron block, start your cold lash .003 tighter--so .015 intake--just as DVW suggested. This will get you close to the cam card spec when hot.
The thing with hot checking, is things begin cooling quickly so only check a couple valves on one side, immediately after running and note the lash. If it's not quite where you'd like it, wait until the next morning when it's good and cooled, then adjust to make up the difference. So for example--if your hot reading was .020, and you wanted .018, go another .002 tighter on the cold lash. If you try to adjust them all to hot spec after running, by the time you work your way around the engine they will all be a little different due to things cooling off.

Thank you very much for the nice explanation, Now I understand the way to go I think .

 

[Moparjack 489]

But what means this list , they add all the time in cold condition , with iron to iron and iron to aluminum

 

[Moparjack 489]

Sorry , they also subtract from iron to aluminum heads about 0.06 . Perfect , understand . But you guys recommend tk start with 0.03 subtract in cold check conditions . thanks at all, I learn and understand a lot this hour more about valve lash

 

[beanhead]

View attachment 973277 But what means this list , they add all the time in cold condition , with iron to iron and iron to aluminum

I think you'll find that chart to get you very close. For aluminum heads on iron block, they're subtracting lash. Going by their numbers, you would cold lash your intake valves to .012". The .003 tighter lash was suggested as a starting point. You may or may not need to go more.
Remember--it's all relative to how your engine performs at a given setting. You may find your combo picks up some pep at a slightly different spec than the card. Trial and error is the only way to get it truly spot-on. Target the card spec as a starting point and you won't go wrong.

 

[Bad B-rad]

I will do tomorrow , but I think the guys a right and the notches for intake valve clearance

I am also fairly sure he is right, as I had written, way back in post #2!!




I just figured with head gasket off the notches would be much more visible.

What is your plan for this beast?