Built 400 Stalls and Dies after Seafoam

[flint040]

I have a 73 Charger SE, originally a 400 2bbl, rebuilt a few years and changed to 4bbl, almost everything upgraded. Carb is now Holley street Avenger 770. It would shoot black stuff out of the exhaust and diesel during shutdown. I had a friend tune the carb, and no longer does those things, but he said to put some seafoam in the tank and seafoam top end cleaner in the carb. I did that on Sunday, half a can of seafoam in the fuel tank that was half full, and i squirted half of the can of the top end cleaner into the carb throat following the directions on the can.

During the test drive after, it said to drive "spirited" if safe to do so, one of the times i floored it, got to 70mph, let off the throttle, my aftermarket tach went to zero and i could feel the car losing power. I was able to turn off of the road into an apartment complex before it died. I put in park, and it restarted right away. I head home, and it seems normal. I get stopped at stoplight for a bit, make my turn and continue home, but feel it losing power power again, Where i was at i could only turn left but due to oncoming traffic, I couldn't complete the turn before completely dying again. This time I cannot get restarted. I was able to get pushed off of the main road and into a neighborhood where 2 guys were trying to help. I popped the hood, one of them held the throttle all the way, I cranked the key, and it started. As soon as he let go of the throttle, car died again. Can't get restarted. It would turn over but not fire. After sitting for about 30 minutes, I was able to start it, then used to both feet to drive the last mile to get home, keeping rpms up around 1000. Get back home and in the garage, let it sit for 15 minutes, cannot get restarted. I gave up. They guys that helped thought it was flooded, but I didn't that was possible while driving. Doing some research, it almost seemed like it was vapor locked, but it has been driven in hotter temps with no issues.

Last night after work, I was able to start the car, let it warm up and run for 10 minutes, varying the rpms up to 3000, then turned it off. After 10 minutes, I restarted the car, held it at 2000 rpm for a minute and let off. I was exiting the car then it died again. I get back in, restart, it fired, then died right away. Try to restart again, it seems like it wants to but just wont fire. I gave up.

The spark plugs are NGK BKR5E and were changed a few weeks ago when my friend was tuning. I have not checked the plugs because the motor was hot, but will pull a few tonight after work and see. Debating about also changing the oil and adding some more fuel as thats getting kind of low. Gauge isnt 100% accurate but close to E on the needle. Fuel tank and sending unit were replaced a few years ago as well, and I know the vapor canister was removed, if that is pertinent. Just wondering if anyone has ideas on what is happening and how I can fix before all of the car shows start kicking off?

Thanks

 

[Tony Tee]

Black stuff out the exhaust... it's flooding out. Maybe the seafoam dislodged something and is stuck in the needle and seat, overflowing the fuel bowl?

 

[flint040]

Here are some pictures of the motor and the black residue from exhaust. Fuel bowls are between 1/3 to 1/2 full when it was running last night. If there is something in the needle and seat, that means carb rebuild?

 

[AR67GTX]

You can remove the needle and seat and clean without rebuilding. Same for replacement. I probably would pull the fuel bowls and any filters and clean (replace filters) though. They may have some junk in them. Shoot some carb spray through the bleeds in the top of the throats and idle mixture passages too. If you need new bowl gaskets you can buy those individually as well - get the blue, reusable ones.

 

[3sloppydogs]

I gotta ask the obvious. Is the choke operating as it should?

 

[747mopar]

I agree with everything stated so far but the tach dying?? The tach runs off of the coil so it dying could be pointing a finger towards something possible loosing connection on your ignition? From the looks of that exhaust you've got some work ahead of you lol.

Typically heat related fuel issues don't take place out of nowhere, they almost always follow shortly after sitting still for a period of time at a traffic light etc. At cruising speeds there's usually enough fuel moving in the lines and enough air passing through the car to keep it cool enough.

I'd do as recommended, change the fuel filter, clean the carb, check to make sure the choke is working properly (lock it open temporarily if need be), go through your ignition wiring..

 

[furious70]

Check the power valve in the front metering block, maybe it ruptured. Something is making you pig rich.

 

[flint040]

I gotta ask the obvious. Is the choke operating as it should?

No, prior to my friend adjusting the carb, the electric choke was not working, but the car still ran. Now that my friend has worked on it and discovered the choke was not working, he removed it, and safety wired the plate open. It ran great after that for a week before I put the seafoam in it. If the car was running rich, wouldn't smell like gas? It does not. Also, should be noted, the car no longer shoots out the black stuff from exhaust nor diesels during shut down, so at least theres that.

 

[65Fury440]

That is way rich.
Choke plate came loose and closed or needle allowing too much gas through.

 

[eldubb440]

if you're looking for dependability, ditch that pos holley

 

[747mopar]

if you're looking for dependability, ditch that pos holley

Just curious, why POS? Holley or just the Avenger series? I had an 870 Avenger, it took a fair amount of tuning but worked great afterwards although I didn't run it more than a year but only because it was bigger than I needed and I opted for mechanical secondaries.

 

[747mopar]

No, prior to my friend adjusting the carb, the electric choke was not working, but the car still ran. Now that my friend has worked on it and discovered the choke was not working, he removed it, and safety wired the plate open. It ran great after that for a week before I put the seafoam in it. If the car was running rich, wouldn't smell like gas? It does not. Also, should be noted, the car no longer shoots out the black stuff from exhaust nor diesels during shut down, so at least theres that.

So the picture showing black on the concrete was prior to the work being done on the carb? Just clarifying because that's really rich or the result of a start up after the motor being really flooded?

 

[flint040]

So the picture showing black on the concrete was prior to the work being done on the carb? Just clarifying because that's really rich or the result of a start up after the motor being really flooded?

Yes, that picture is before any work on the carb was done.

 

[eldubb440]

Just curious, why POS? Holley or just the Avenger series? I had an 870 Avenger, it took a fair amount of tuning but worked great afterwards although I didn't run it more than a year but only because it was bigger than I needed and I opted for mechanical secondaries.

I haven't run a holley on anything in over 10 years, I gave one a last chance on my 460 Bronco and replaced it with an edelbrock..... I do have a 770 street avenger for my 440 that someone gave me, but haven't bolted it to anything yet (I have zero faith in it). Prior to all of that; my shelf began to pile up with Holleys dating back to the early 80's. Just got sick of the leak stains on aluminum intakes, failed power valves, and whatever other issues leading to overall "undependability"...... After running the same 2 edelbrocks for 20 years on my AMX trouble free; I just don't have anything good to say about Holleys...... they work when they work, they suck when they don't.

the other issue I have is the fuel in the rear bowl sits there and cooks unless used...... edelbrock always has fresh, cool, fuel, and unless the float sticks (which has never happened to me) it is a leak proof design. You can also swap jets and metering rods on the car without making a mess

on a side note, I always use an edelbrock for breaking in a cam; I would never risk using a Holley. I don't hate them. I just don't trust them.

and I have been holding tight to a vintage 650 double pumper because I think it's cool a fok

 

[qkcuda]

If the tank was dirty seafoam may have dislodged it, plugging the fuel filter. It happened to me bringing the Charger home. It would run for a while, then start losing power and stall. I changed the filter and it was good. It is a cheap fix to try before tearing into the carb.

 

[Tony Tee]

The other meaning of POS = Perfectly Operating Smoothly. Lol!

 

[hunt2elk]

I had a piece of crap prevent the needle and seat from sealing once. Fuel bowl filled, flooded, and died while I was driving it. So if your fuel level is 1/2 in the bowl, I wouldn't think that would be your problem.

 

[furious70]

Interesting, maybe you were pig rich and now starving from junk being broke loose.

Since I don't know you, do you feel like you can tell the difference between an engine flooding out while driving vs starving? Flooding will bog and chug but usually take off hard if you floor it as demand is greater. Starving goes weak and won't recover.

 

[747mopar]

I haven't run a holley on anything in over 10 years, I gave one a last chance on my 460 Bronco and replaced it with an edelbrock..... I do have a 770 street avenger for my 440 that someone gave me, but haven't bolted it to anything yet (I have zero faith in it). Prior to all of that; my shelf began to pile up with Holleys dating back to the early 80's. Just got sick of the leak stains on aluminum intakes, failed power valves, and whatever other issues leading to overall "undependability"...... After running the same 2 edelbrocks for 20 years on my AMX trouble free; I just don't have anything good to say about Holleys...... they work when they work, they suck when they don't.

the other issue I have is the fuel in the rear bowl sits there and cooks unless used...... edelbrock always has fresh, cool, fuel, and unless the float sticks (which has never happened to me) it is a leak proof design. You can also swap jets and metering rods on the car without making a mess

on a side note, I always use an edelbrock for breaking in a cam; I would never risk using a Holley. I don't hate them. I just don't trust them.

and I have been holding tight to a vintage 650 double pumper because I think it's cool a fok

My experience has been the exact opposite and ironically enough on a 460 as well, vapor locked and spewed gas repeatedly... Brand new I might add. Replaced it with a Holley lol. Haven't owned an Eddy since, running a QF now.

Carburetors are one of those things where people just find what they like and seldomly turn back.

 

[747mopar]

I had a starvation problem a while back but mine ran perfectly until you got up into the rpm's then you'd feel it slow then start to blubber. I put a T in the fuel line and taped a fuel pressure gauge to the outside of the windshield, sure enough as I climbed in RPM the pressure dropped until it hit zero and the symptoms would start. Mine was a weak fuel pump but the same test would tell you if your problem was before the carburetor, if it isn't keeping the bowl full you'll see it on the gauge.