Rich idle is killing me

Fuel and Air Systems

  1. 91r/t

    91r/t FBBO Gold Member FBBO Gold Member

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    I can't tun shit with the vacuum gauge as far as fuel mixture screws go. That just keeps increasing as I screw em in and the car runs like shit lean. So I left them where they are and it seems to be happy there for now. Now I know why some of you guys that have been at this for 40 years say to hell with it and go buy a hellcat!
    :thumbsup::thumbsup:
     
  2. 68 HEMI GTS

    68 HEMI GTS Well-Known Member

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    I can order a lot of stroker kits from 440 source for what the cost of that hellcat is

     
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    • 91r/t

      91r/t FBBO Gold Member FBBO Gold Member

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      :lol:
       
    • Bigal75

      Bigal75 Well-Known Member

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      So you can get it to lean out now?
       
    • 91r/t

      91r/t FBBO Gold Member FBBO Gold Member

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      Yea at a higher idle its way better. If I dump it back down to 750-800 RPM I can actually watch it start to load up and smoke a bit after 20 seconds or so of idling there. Then I bump it back up to 900ish RPM and it'll clean up once you crack the throttle a few times and clean it out. I have to remove the carb AGAIN and open up my holes in my throttle plates a bit to get some more air in. Right now, I am using my secondary throttle plates too much I feel and have too much transfer slot open and exposed. I wanna get that closed up a bit and maintain my 900RPM idle. I figure I will go up 2 drill sizes on them and see how that likes it. If I go too much, I have a spare set of throttle blades I can use to undo that. That new Holley XP carb they offer with the air bleed inside the center hole for the air cleaner stud is an awesome way to combat this problem of on again/off again for the carb drilling/adjustment. :D
       
    • Bigal75

      Bigal75 Well-Known Member

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      Nothing wrong with a 900 rpm idle. Do you have a wideband o2 sensor? I'm not sure drilling throttle blades is the right thing to do in this case.
       
    • 91r/t

      91r/t FBBO Gold Member FBBO Gold Member

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      They are already drilled. All four plates have been drilled since I first started tuning the engine this spring. ZERO chance this engine idles without them drilled even at 28 intial at idle and 34 total. Tried that before I drilled my new plates I installed and it needed to be so far open it was hopeless. I do not have a wideband O2 but I am going to drive the car a bit the way it is anyway and see how it acts. If it drives nice and doesn't burn my eyes, I may leave it the way it is for now.
       
    • ddpsnake

      ddpsnake Well-Known Member

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      i told ya to raise the secondary clean this up.
       
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      • miller

        miller Well-Known Member

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        Mine is a totally different animal, mild-ish cam, crossram w/600cfm Eddys. Your big cam is a big game player, getting it dialed in.
        I had problems with mine too rich, loads of carbon, and trying to adjust mixture via RPMs, was not getting any results. Had been checking manifold sealing, with a vacuum gauge, getting 16". Decided to play with the screws a little, going by vacuum, leaning it, vacuum up to 18". No more carbon, cleaned up real good.
        Though, on mine, jetting is about right, in range. Don't know on your's, including the cam. Makes for a good fight! Good luck on it.
         
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        • 91r/t

          91r/t FBBO Gold Member FBBO Gold Member

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          It is raised now. Conflicting info. One says raise the secondary and other says no transfer on the secondary......Right now I am messing with some small stuff but it is pretty close. Essentially by opening the secondaries that far, you are taking the engine into the transition circuit and off the idle circuit. I can add air via drilled plates, and stay on the idle circuit of the carb. Now I have seen multiple different info on this as well. Some say the secondaries are not doing anything until they are open and others say it is drawing fuel in the transfer slots on the secondary no matter what the throttle position is or whether the secondaries are active or not.

          :thumbsup:
           
          Last edited: Jun 18, 2019
        • 91r/t

          91r/t FBBO Gold Member FBBO Gold Member

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          Yup my powerwagon 360 and my Runner are both close to stock. Both can be tuned with a vacuum gauge for the idle. This thing HATES the idle setting where vacuum is greatest. Acts lean and surges. It wants fuel. I am just finding the happy medium between fuel needed and fuel not needed to burn the eyes a bit less. At this point the way it sits, it is off the idle circuit using the secondaries to adjust the idle this high, so it needs to be drilled a bit bigger and then transfer slots closed up so its back on the idle circuit.
           
        • ddpsnake

          ddpsnake Well-Known Member

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          yes opening them up just a tad could pull fuel,you just have to turn down the idle,that it wont pull fuel,giving more air.my last 360 69 dart had the 280-474 purple cam that ran rich big time,opening the secondaries up just past the slot sure help.glad your getting there.good luck.

          sony pic 203.jpg
           
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          • 91r/t

            91r/t FBBO Gold Member FBBO Gold Member

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            Think I should supplement the air from the blades being open with a little larger holes in my plates to keep fuel from dragging in on the transition circuit, or leave it as is with the secondary blades open a decent amount? I noticed my power brakes and vacuum canister being a bit worse so I think if I can get the blades closed and the holes bigger, I can help that as well.
             
          • Fran Blacker

            Fran Blacker FBBO Gold Member FBBO Gold Member

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            Thank for starting thread. Have battled same thing with about the same cam specs. With 2-3116's on a crossram. Ifr hole is .060 dia, put a set screw drilled to .030 to lean carb out with some success but could be better. Pic putting drilled set screw in tapped hole. c1.jpg
             
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            • 91r/t

              91r/t FBBO Gold Member FBBO Gold Member

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              :thumbsup:
               
            • 68 HEMI GTS

              68 HEMI GTS Well-Known Member

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              Gotta move them IFR’s low
              32B52DA6-249B-444A-BE9D-447B3842B9F3.jpeg 76A0692E-66F3-481A-9077-184B1335ACE0.jpeg

              They’re decently sized. Try 1# drill larger at a time.

              20903FCE-C47E-4A8A-81EB-D71BD6D22EB6.jpeg E71399B3-2D6E-474A-B711-D078D27C2F29.jpeg B70EC252-4C05-4E6E-9C1C-37A9266E0953.jpeg
               
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              • 91r/t

                91r/t FBBO Gold Member FBBO Gold Member

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                Holley Sniper EFI is looking better and better by the minute.....HAHA
                 
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                • Fran Blacker

                  Fran Blacker FBBO Gold Member FBBO Gold Member

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                  If you talking about my post, your advice to keep IFR's low? Been follow your work on carbs since a thread or a post "Idles like a six cylinder". Wondering how those carbs are setup. Been watching hoping to pick up tips. Didn't want to hijack thread but your box is full.
                   
                  Last edited: Jun 18, 2019
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                  • 68 HEMI GTS

                    68 HEMI GTS Well-Known Member

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                    Should come through now
                     
                  • BSB67

                    BSB67 FBBO Gold Member FBBO Gold Member

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                    Please tell us all of your cam specs. Advertised duration and 0.050" duration for both intake and exhaust, LSA, ICL, hydraulic or solid. If its a solid, what the lash setting is. Then tell us what you've done to confirm that there is no vacuum leak. A lean miss at idle due to a vacuum leak can be subtle, and will always cause your eyes to burn, and almost always perceived as "it's too fat at idle".

                    Honestly, for me, it's a little hard to believe you're even on the right track. I put bigger cams in smaller motors back in the 1970s, 80s and 90s, way before there was an adjustable anything on a carb, and they would run better out of the box than what you're describing.
                     
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