68 HEMI GTS
Well-Known Member
Happen to know the list numbers on the mechanical carbs?
541 street strip motor, TF 270 heads, Weiand P3690982 cross ram or???
- Thread starter biomedtechguy
- Start date
- Local time
- 7:31 PM
- Joined
- Mar 28, 2014
- Messages
- 33,785
- Reaction score
- 53,653
- Location
- South Louisiana
I'll ask him.
Let me wait until he ships the intake.
The last time I asked for pictures of the mechanical carbs, and suggested maybe we could make a deal on those, somehow he thought I expected to get the 3 mech 2bbl carbs and the intake for under $1k
Then an unexpected **** storm occurred.
He also complained that he discounted the intake to give me a break because I don't have much money (true, I spend it all) which I never claimed to him to be poor, and then complained because "I obviously Iied if I was asking about the mech carbs"
Geesh!
- Local time
- 7:31 PM
- Joined
- Mar 28, 2014
- Messages
- 33,785
- Reaction score
- 53,653
- Location
- South Louisiana
I'm picking up an A12 fiberglass 6bbl base, rubber seal, and air filter top.
Price is right and it may help me put together a workable Air Grabber w/the Weiand.
If not, I'll pass along my good fortune.
Price is right and it may help me put together a workable Air Grabber w/the Weiand.
If not, I'll pass along my good fortune.
- Local time
- 7:31 PM
- Joined
- Mar 28, 2014
- Messages
- 33,785
- Reaction score
- 53,653
- Location
- South Louisiana
Here's the posts from the other very active Mopar forum.
This is the one that made me decide buying the intake was worth a try:
"IF you can find the Weiand SS intake, it can be made to fit with the N96 . A friend ran a 70 RR 440 6 pak 4 speed in Super Stock back in the day. To get the hood to close, he did some trimming to the black plastic (fiberglass or what ever it was made of) adapter that mounts to the hood. He pulled the radiator and water pump and then shut the hood so he could see where it needed to be trimmed and kept whittling on it until he could shut the hood all the way."
And again, when I asked him for confirmation:
"Well You have the intake now. So prove it to your self this Saturday.
Take the aircleaner assembly off your current 6 pack set up and shut the hood wih the Air Grabber open. If you can meaure how far below the hood the stock set up is.
Put your Weiand set up on your motor with out the air cleaner and slowly shut the hood with the airgrabber open. measure the difference.
I know for a fact my friend ran that set up on his original 70 RR 440 6 barrel with the factory carbs and he had to make the modifications that are show in the line above to get it to run right. I wish I still had the pictures. His air box was still in place attached to the hood but had been trimmed to get the hood to shut completely.
He also had the factory 906 heads with standard port location. I am not certain it will work with the Trick Flow or Edelbrock raised intake port heads. That is why I suggested you try it wothout the aircleaner in place first."
So I should receive it late next week, and I'll have to order a new aluminum tub style intake manifold gasket, and check the jets I have on hand, see what the Chrysler Performance bulletin calls for re: accelerator pump cam, jets, convert the metering plate hole sizes to jet size, etc.
I'll try it set up like the bulletin recommends and I have a dual wideband O2 gauge and data logger to help me see what's going on.
I do need to see what I can use or buy to mount the throttle cable bracket, because the Weiand doesn't have one with it. At least I don't have to have a transmission kickdown lever. 3 pedal cars RULE!
This is the one that made me decide buying the intake was worth a try:
"IF you can find the Weiand SS intake, it can be made to fit with the N96 . A friend ran a 70 RR 440 6 pak 4 speed in Super Stock back in the day. To get the hood to close, he did some trimming to the black plastic (fiberglass or what ever it was made of) adapter that mounts to the hood. He pulled the radiator and water pump and then shut the hood so he could see where it needed to be trimmed and kept whittling on it until he could shut the hood all the way."
And again, when I asked him for confirmation:
"Well You have the intake now. So prove it to your self this Saturday.
Take the aircleaner assembly off your current 6 pack set up and shut the hood wih the Air Grabber open. If you can meaure how far below the hood the stock set up is.
Put your Weiand set up on your motor with out the air cleaner and slowly shut the hood with the airgrabber open. measure the difference.
I know for a fact my friend ran that set up on his original 70 RR 440 6 barrel with the factory carbs and he had to make the modifications that are show in the line above to get it to run right. I wish I still had the pictures. His air box was still in place attached to the hood but had been trimmed to get the hood to shut completely.
He also had the factory 906 heads with standard port location. I am not certain it will work with the Trick Flow or Edelbrock raised intake port heads. That is why I suggested you try it wothout the aircleaner in place first."
So I should receive it late next week, and I'll have to order a new aluminum tub style intake manifold gasket, and check the jets I have on hand, see what the Chrysler Performance bulletin calls for re: accelerator pump cam, jets, convert the metering plate hole sizes to jet size, etc.
I'll try it set up like the bulletin recommends and I have a dual wideband O2 gauge and data logger to help me see what's going on.
I do need to see what I can use or buy to mount the throttle cable bracket, because the Weiand doesn't have one with it. At least I don't have to have a transmission kickdown lever. 3 pedal cars RULE!
gooser
Well-Known Member
the set up that chysler put out are for ss cars. back in the day the all the fast ss 6pk cars were running 750 roller cams and 5.13 gears also I would check the #2 cylinder runner my intake had some core shift it was about 1/8 inch off from alinement with the port just saying check it not hard to fix. I think the carb # were 4782
- Local time
- 7:31 PM
- Joined
- Mar 28, 2014
- Messages
- 33,785
- Reaction score
- 53,653
- Location
- South Louisiana
Thanks for the heads up.
Once I install it, I'll light up the runners and see what it looks like at the head intake port.
- Local time
- 5:31 PM
- Joined
- Jan 16, 2011
- Messages
- 70,774
- Reaction score
- 102,252
- Location
- NorCal Sierras
- Local time
- 7:31 PM
- Joined
- Mar 28, 2014
- Messages
- 33,785
- Reaction score
- 53,653
- Location
- South Louisiana
That's one of my favorite "popcorn" GIFs.
Budnicks, you especially know how much (too much) how many (too many) posts I've written about this intake, stroker motor plans, etc.
Especially this damn Weiand intake.
This isn't even my first thread on this intake!
Last time I was in negotiations with 2 guys who each had the intake, one guy had a couple of them, I was in the parking lot of my bank, basically to buy one and I decided not to.
After a couple of weeks (and lots of posts) referencing the ModMan intake w/3x2 top, my current Edelbrock/Chrysler aluminum 6bbl intake, getting mixed reviews, being directed to numerous threads on a couple of forums, I had even researched the Edelbrock STR series w/the 3x2bbl top (EVERY comparison of the STR vs Weiand favored the Weiand, and the Chrysler Performance manual says the Weiand 6bbl makes the most power) the ONE THING that kept me from getting it is the number of people who said it would NOT fit under my N96 hood.
Well like I wrote, the guy on the other busy Mopar forum said it would, it did, it was on his friend's 70 N96 Air Grabber equipped Roadrunner that he ran in Super Stock...
So that did it! That was my tipping point.
Now the bonus for me, being geeky about this kind of "lore" is the backstory of this particular intake coming from a Chrysler Performance dyno operator/engineer and that this particular intake may be the one that the Chrysler Performance R&D bulletin and drawings were based upon. I wish I had documentation of that, but the whole story is plausible.
Anyway I am going to do my best to make trying it out and tuning it a FUN experience, and I have a pretty good tool installed to help me with that-my Innovate Motorsports dual wideband O2 system.
So once I see for myself that it fits, before I go carving on my used, yet to be installed air box, I will see how my current engine responds to the Weiand.
If it fits but I try everything I can to tune it and I'm not satisfied with the results, I'll keep it and send it to the builder for the stroker motor, and if it is decided that the Trick Flow 270s are a better choice than the 240s, I'll have the runners opened up to Max Wedge port size. The last step will be to equip it with the F&B 3x2 throttle body direct port injection system.
So if it fits, it will be with me for the long run.
Thanks again to all of you!
This thread is like a giant train wreck with a bench racing session from high school! The problem is that Bio is such a nice guy and soooo courteous that I can't stop myself from reading it... Carry on!
- Local time
- 7:31 PM
- Joined
- Mar 28, 2014
- Messages
- 33,785
- Reaction score
- 53,653
- Location
- South Louisiana
Lol.
I know I've leaned on some of your level of patience, especially in The Racers Hangout, but what has come forth from that?
I was convinced that a good leaf spring traction bar setup was going to do justice to my traction and cruising needs, without being as invasive to my V-code as a triangulated 4 link-that I was "so sure" I was going to get.
The Weiand 6bbl intake is on its way here, and I may bring some current insight to what it's really like.
I have read (across the www) a lot more accolades for it than naysayers. Even Chrysler Performance said it was the best 6bbl intake for power, and the only design that was superior is a dual quad.
I've learned about bias ply drag tires being the best for a 3 pedal car.
I may bring a whole new perspective to using a manual transmission in high performance applications once I put the HitMaster to the test.
Then again, I may find that all of the warnings were right, and come back here with my tail between my legs.
Or maybe a little of each.
Thanks again to all of you!
Posting here is all I can do until I make my wishes reality, and I really need the motivation I get from you!
- Local time
- 7:31 PM
- Joined
- Mar 28, 2014
- Messages
- 33,785
- Reaction score
- 53,653
- Location
- South Louisiana
Here's a quick chronology of how this Weiand intake deal went down. At the end, I'm posting pictures of what I think is a hacked up piece of **** that I received yesterday.
Pontiac forum (because of our GTO). A regular poster PMs me "Any of your stuff 440 Mopar?" because like I mention the GTO on this forum from time to time, I mention the Roadrunner over there.
The back and forth PMs somehow get misunderstood by the seller. Short story, I got the Weiand for $600 less than the asking price. The seller also has the 3 500 CFM Holley 6bbl mechanical carbs, so after he offered me the $600 off and I agreed to buy it, I asked about the Holley carbs and said maybe we could make a deal on those. Somehow he thinks I expect the intake and carbs for the agreed upon price of the intake! I'm really besides myself as to how that could have possibly been derived from my messages, and the guy posts **** about me on the forum post where he was offering the items. I posted my defense, and was going to write it up to experience. Well I guess we both "cooled off" and the original intake deal was back on.
I send him a bank check, and a shipping label (my cost) and a couple of days later while I'm on the road working I call him. That's when I find out the intake in the pictures he posted is NOT the actual intake he's selling me. He describes the intake mods, and the source, and offers an unmodified intake. I figured based on the description that the modded one will save me some work. After all, it came from a "Chrysler Performance dyno engineer" so it's got to be righteous work, right?
WRONG!
It took me about 2 minutes once I opened the box to decide I didn't want this hacked up intake. The areas that had material removed looked like they were done on a bench grinder with a 12" wheel by a meth addict on a 5 day binge. I contacted the seller immediately, and sent the intake back today (I just got it yesterday). I hope to be able to get the unmodded one, AFTER I see pictures of the exact intake. Either that (which is what I'm hoping for) or I'll get my money back and be out $70 shipping.
Look and tell me if I'm wrong about this being a really half-assed modding effort:
Holes by center carb are not in the Chrysler Performance bulletin, and like all of the areas where material was removed just looks rushed and half-assed:
The area behind the one outboard carb hole is rushed looking too, and not enough material left of the original hole by the carb surface:
These are the "dams" LMAO!
And the bulletin calls for ALL intake ports to be "radiused 5/16" and BLENDED into the plenum floor. Lol! They were ground so deep I was concerned that the port may have a paper thin amount of material left where the sharp, deep angle cuts are:
So am I overreacting or is this a half assed hack job?
Here are 2 pictures from the "for sale" post he made:
I'd say not even CLOSE!
Pontiac forum (because of our GTO). A regular poster PMs me "Any of your stuff 440 Mopar?" because like I mention the GTO on this forum from time to time, I mention the Roadrunner over there.
The back and forth PMs somehow get misunderstood by the seller. Short story, I got the Weiand for $600 less than the asking price. The seller also has the 3 500 CFM Holley 6bbl mechanical carbs, so after he offered me the $600 off and I agreed to buy it, I asked about the Holley carbs and said maybe we could make a deal on those. Somehow he thinks I expect the intake and carbs for the agreed upon price of the intake! I'm really besides myself as to how that could have possibly been derived from my messages, and the guy posts **** about me on the forum post where he was offering the items. I posted my defense, and was going to write it up to experience. Well I guess we both "cooled off" and the original intake deal was back on.
I send him a bank check, and a shipping label (my cost) and a couple of days later while I'm on the road working I call him. That's when I find out the intake in the pictures he posted is NOT the actual intake he's selling me. He describes the intake mods, and the source, and offers an unmodified intake. I figured based on the description that the modded one will save me some work. After all, it came from a "Chrysler Performance dyno engineer" so it's got to be righteous work, right?
WRONG!
It took me about 2 minutes once I opened the box to decide I didn't want this hacked up intake. The areas that had material removed looked like they were done on a bench grinder with a 12" wheel by a meth addict on a 5 day binge. I contacted the seller immediately, and sent the intake back today (I just got it yesterday). I hope to be able to get the unmodded one, AFTER I see pictures of the exact intake. Either that (which is what I'm hoping for) or I'll get my money back and be out $70 shipping.
Look and tell me if I'm wrong about this being a really half-assed modding effort:
Holes by center carb are not in the Chrysler Performance bulletin, and like all of the areas where material was removed just looks rushed and half-assed:
The area behind the one outboard carb hole is rushed looking too, and not enough material left of the original hole by the carb surface:
These are the "dams" LMAO!
And the bulletin calls for ALL intake ports to be "radiused 5/16" and BLENDED into the plenum floor. Lol! They were ground so deep I was concerned that the port may have a paper thin amount of material left where the sharp, deep angle cuts are:
So am I overreacting or is this a half assed hack job?
Here are 2 pictures from the "for sale" post he made:
I'd say not even CLOSE!
Last edited:
gooser
Well-Known Member
the holes for the middle carb are not right the dams look like crap this guy should have paid the shipping to send it back not you
- Local time
- 7:31 PM
- Joined
- Mar 28, 2014
- Messages
- 33,785
- Reaction score
- 53,653
- Location
- South Louisiana
Thanks. Look, I have a FedEx acct, it's $35 to ship, and in the grand scheme of things it wasn't the battleground to die on.
It only took about 1 minute for me to decide no way did I want that intake.
Hopefully the other "unmodified" one is available and in good condition. I asked for pictures of the actual intake before I agree to receive it!
66Satellite47
Well-Known Member
Good luck!
- Local time
- 7:31 PM
- Joined
- Mar 28, 2014
- Messages
- 33,785
- Reaction score
- 53,653
- Location
- South Louisiana
I was on the road again yesterday and that's the best time for me to talk.
The seller and I talked gearhead for 55 minutes!
I believe that if he can get the unmodded intake to me he will, and that's what I want.
If not, I'm sure I'll get my money back.
I'll post pix of the "unmodded intake" when I get them, BEFORE he boxes it up and ships it, like I SHOULD HAVE with the last one!
The seller and I talked gearhead for 55 minutes!
I believe that if he can get the unmodded intake to me he will, and that's what I want.
If not, I'm sure I'll get my money back.
I'll post pix of the "unmodded intake" when I get them, BEFORE he boxes it up and ships it, like I SHOULD HAVE with the last one!
- Local time
- 7:31 PM
- Joined
- Mar 28, 2014
- Messages
- 33,785
- Reaction score
- 53,653
- Location
- South Louisiana
By the way, these are the mods I'm going to try first. Quicker AND faster according to the guy who did these, after trying the Chrysler Performance bulletin mods!
Other than radiusing the sharp edges of the intake runners where they meet the plenum floor, which I am going to do, and he also did, the rest of his mods in these pix are easy to undo! The concept is to reduce fuel puddling, prevent any liquid fuel from running down the intake runners, and the 2 large wood blocks reduce plenum volume, increasing the signal to the carbs and increasing velocity!
I LIKE IT!
Other than radiusing the sharp edges of the intake runners where they meet the plenum floor, which I am going to do, and he also did, the rest of his mods in these pix are easy to undo! The concept is to reduce fuel puddling, prevent any liquid fuel from running down the intake runners, and the 2 large wood blocks reduce plenum volume, increasing the signal to the carbs and increasing velocity!
I LIKE IT!
69sunfireGTX
Well-Known Member
That looks pretty scary to me. I hope you know what you are doing. 
- Local time
- 7:31 PM
- Joined
- Mar 28, 2014
- Messages
- 33,785
- Reaction score
- 53,653
- Location
- South Louisiana
Vintage Chromoly agrees! Lol.
What part is scary? I certainly want to use a material (epoxy or epoxy putty) that will not break up/off or degrade under heat and vibration. I just sent an email to the guy who did those mods, but that article was LONG ago, so I may not hear back.
The mods that were pictured last are the easiest to reverse!
I took a measurement of the height of the hacked up intake I received before I sent it back so I can get an idea of its fit underhood.
Once I get it in and tweaked to satisfaction, I'm going to have it hydro dipped in tiger stripes with "V.C" initials in honor of vintage chromoly, because I know he'd LOVE the look!
Hey VC, you know I'm kidding you and I truly appreciate your advice and suggestions and admonitions! After all, you are a big reason why I'm about to order Calvert rear suspension parts!
From the guy who did those mods:
Here's the excerpt from the guy who did the unique mods: (my bolds)
From Dennis: “After MANY attempts at making this manifold work as per Direct Connection Tech Bulletins, I decided to go my own way. I reduced the plenum volume as per photos,and added the tear drops on the floor to attempt to keep fuel from puddling on the floor. Added a raised edge around the runners also to stop puddled fuel from running down the runners. After the photos I added a higher edge around the runners for #5 & 7 to stop a highspeed miss and plug fouling on cyl. #5.
Started with jetting same as stk. EDELBROCK intake front carb: 77, center: 66, rear: 79. MECHANICAL CARBs. #0-4783
Ran well but missed at top of each gear, #5 plug fouls. Added raised edge on #5-7, fixed problem.
Raised jetting to (1) 80, (2) 68, (3) 82. This change resulted in a .09 reduction in E.T. in the 1/8th. and 1.3mph improvement.
I`m happy with the results so far,but expect to gain another 10th as I settle on the optimum runner size and jetting.
The actual improvement so far is 21/100ths, and 2.3 mph from the D.C. set-up and where it is today: 6.42 ET @ 106.63 mph, 1.42-60ft., 3,070 wt., 440/3.75stroke, 4.10 ratio, .590" D.C. cam, 12.34-1 CR, 93 octane - unleaded.
These mods are for development purposes ONLY, and as I make progress I will make more refined mods in a more ‘professional appearing method’.”
What part is scary? I certainly want to use a material (epoxy or epoxy putty) that will not break up/off or degrade under heat and vibration. I just sent an email to the guy who did those mods, but that article was LONG ago, so I may not hear back.
The mods that were pictured last are the easiest to reverse!
I took a measurement of the height of the hacked up intake I received before I sent it back so I can get an idea of its fit underhood.
Once I get it in and tweaked to satisfaction, I'm going to have it hydro dipped in tiger stripes with "V.C" initials in honor of vintage chromoly, because I know he'd LOVE the look!
Hey VC, you know I'm kidding you and I truly appreciate your advice and suggestions and admonitions! After all, you are a big reason why I'm about to order Calvert rear suspension parts!
From the guy who did those mods:
Here's the excerpt from the guy who did the unique mods: (my bolds)
From Dennis: “After MANY attempts at making this manifold work as per Direct Connection Tech Bulletins, I decided to go my own way. I reduced the plenum volume as per photos,and added the tear drops on the floor to attempt to keep fuel from puddling on the floor. Added a raised edge around the runners also to stop puddled fuel from running down the runners. After the photos I added a higher edge around the runners for #5 & 7 to stop a highspeed miss and plug fouling on cyl. #5.
Started with jetting same as stk. EDELBROCK intake front carb: 77, center: 66, rear: 79. MECHANICAL CARBs. #0-4783
Ran well but missed at top of each gear, #5 plug fouls. Added raised edge on #5-7, fixed problem.
Raised jetting to (1) 80, (2) 68, (3) 82. This change resulted in a .09 reduction in E.T. in the 1/8th. and 1.3mph improvement.
I`m happy with the results so far,but expect to gain another 10th as I settle on the optimum runner size and jetting.
The actual improvement so far is 21/100ths, and 2.3 mph from the D.C. set-up and where it is today: 6.42 ET @ 106.63 mph, 1.42-60ft., 3,070 wt., 440/3.75stroke, 4.10 ratio, .590" D.C. cam, 12.34-1 CR, 93 octane - unleaded.
These mods are for development purposes ONLY, and as I make progress I will make more refined mods in a more ‘professional appearing method’.”
vintage chromoly
Well-Known Member
It’s all good Bio.
I love your passion.
Those mods look wacky though.
I love your passion.
Those mods look wacky though.
- Local time
- 7:31 PM
- Joined
- Mar 28, 2014
- Messages
- 33,785
- Reaction score
- 53,653
- Location
- South Louisiana
I sincerely appreciate your participation in that rear suspension thread, and all of them, of course. I went from "being sure" for at least a year, that the only decision left to make for the rear suspension was RMS or Gerst...
Then someone suggested ladder bars, I started that thread, and although the "cheerleaders" for a well thought out and implemented/adjusted leaf springs setup have always been in abundance, I had previously discounted much of their commentary as either being forced to run leaf springs because of the class/category they ran in, or just being happy to "settle" for improving a very old design. I still like the triangulated 4 link setups, but I may have wound up with "too many adjustments" available and I may not have been able to get as solid or accurate advice for my application to work properly as I can get with a Calvert split mono leaf springs and Assassin traction bars setup. The latter being simpler. I'll just start with the 3 way adjustable CEE-2730 Competition Engineering rear shocks I have now, and work with the 18 way double adjustable Viking front shocks. I think the new springs and Assassin traction bars, along with using my line lock for the first time, and the HitMaster launch control system are going to take me a LONG way towards much better 60ft times than the crappy 2 second range I'm in now.
@vintage chromoly ...What about the hydro dipped tiger stripes on the Weiand intake??
LOL...
Similar threads
