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Electrical issues with pictures battery cable

northeastmoparnet

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OK folks who have been following this thread. I have been trying hard to solve this issue. I checked and replaced my starter with a new mini starter. I replaced my starter solenoid switch. I checked all the connections and made sure they were all clean and tight. It was then mentioned on here to check my negative battery cable. I checked it as stated and everything looked fine. Now I know way up front looking for help I also said that electrical was not my strong area. I also had one or two fellow members tell me to change my negative battery cable. I do not want anyone to ever think I am not listening. And I did order a brand new made in the USA correct negative battery cable as I had on this car since it was totally restored in 2007. Car has always been in a heated garage and never out in the weather. Only took it for Sunday drives and car shows. I did receive the new negative cable today. Installed it in place and to my surprise, the new mini starter jumped to life. I could not believe that the cable was the problem. Because I had my steering wheel apart, I was assuming it was something I did, but again, I am pretty by the book guy. So my next step was to take the old cable and cut away the area in which I feel the problem was actually located. The battery lug where the two ground wires were molded into the end. I am now attaching pictures for good info and really wanted to know WHY? Looking at the cutaway you can see that these wires were twisted into 7 little bunches. They then appear to be just packed together and inserted into the lead terminal and then probably pressed in by machine. If you look at the smaller ground wire that attaches to the radiator/body support, you will also see it is twisted and also inerted into it's hole and crimped. So there also seems to be almost like a solder coating some of wraps and not all of them the same?? Which presents a question. I don't think these individual wraps would have been soldered and I think the solder you see on those wires is actually melted away from the battery lug due to corrosion and lots of resistance heat. So I am now concluding that when I tried to start my car, the power because of an incomplete circuit was trying hard to complete the circuit at the battery lug and could not get there, but it seeked a source of ground which was the other two small headlight ground wires that also go to and under the same fastener on the radiator support as the one coming off the battery lug. So those beacame the path of least resistance rather than being able to get back to the negative side of the battery, just followed the wires right to the end and melted those two headlight ground wires. Now, my question so I can really understand what took place is this? Were those 7 individual twisted sets soldered before the cable was built at the factory, or is the silver you see just the lead melted into them due to high resistance at this point which sent the power down the thinner ground wires as opposed to back to the battery right there at that junction. In the end, I would never have thought this cable would fail so badly and am just posting this for all to read and try and understand what happened. And I have to thank the members who told me to change that cable. You were correct, by now I want to know how and why so that in the future others can undersatand this as well. Thanks to all who helped.

IMG_3128_4739.JPG


IMG_3130_4741.JPG
 
The starter takes as many amps as it takes to turn the engine. Approx 200-250. actual number not important.

Now BOTH battery cables need to flow that many amps for the starter to function.

Due to bad connection (resistance) that negative cable couldn't flow enough amps to make the starter work.

To make it harder to find, it will flow enough amps to turn on lights, radio and other small draw electrical things so it makes you think it's fine and the starter is bad.
 
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That is not the first of that problem.
Soldered joints have no business in car wiring.
Mechanical attachment, ie crimps, are the way its done.
 
That is not the first of that problem.
Soldered joints have no business in car wiring.
Mechanical attachment, ie crimps, are the way its done.
That is not the first of that problem.
Soldered joints have no business in car wiring.
Mechanical attachment, ie crimps, are the way its done.
Soldiered joints provide excellent joints
 
Soldiered joints provide excellent joints
My question is: Are those wires actually soldered before they are crimped into the battery lug or is that solder I am seeing actually melted lead from the battery lug because of high resistance melting going on?? These cables were made in usa cables to mopar standards of 1970. The new negative cable I just installed is a carbon copy of what I had. Paid 90 bucks for that cable and was not going to listen to all on here who told me to go to autozone and buy a $20 cable. There is a reason for spending money and a reason not to try and save money.
 
You were told in your first post were the problem was by several of us. You were adamant it was perfect. Why the cable failure is simple CCJ.
 
Glad you've come forward and shown that those that said to throw a jumper cable on from battery to block and try were correct. At least Pnora saved you from frying your brand new headlight harness!

As for the main cable wires, YES... the best way to get a good "overpour" for connection would be to separate the main cable into smaller sections and then POUR the terminal end so the lead flows around everything and bonds into place.

Since you didn't show a "before" picture, I can't tell if that terminal end was swaged onto the cable or poured.
 
Glad you've come forward and shown that those that said to throw a jumper cable on from battery to block and try were correct. At least Pnora saved you from frying your brand new headlight harness!

As for the main cable wires, YES... the best way to get a good "overpour" for connection would be to separate the main cable into smaller sections and then POUR the terminal end so the lead flows around everything and bonds into place.

Since you didn't show a "before" picture, I can't tell if that terminal end was swaged onto the cable or poured.
OK. I appologize for saying the cable was perfect. My mistake in a world pf perfectionists. So now that I installed a new cable and proved you guys to be correct, I am trying to understand what I posted in the pictures Funny, I can wire a whole house with a/c power but this dc **** confuses me and I stated that from right up front. The cables on this car were bought from Year One and were factory correct made in USA cables. I am trying to understand what would have caused this to happen so I know next time what to look for, because as I stated early on, (that cable looked perfect) No melting of outer jscket, no white phosphorus, no green copper oxidation amd very clean unpainted connections as per install instructions. So, if you cannot see inside that battery cable to battery connector, I would say (it looked perfect). Which now I am trying to understand why or what caused the high resistance in that cable. The outer jcket went right up to that lead and hid any view of the wire. But when I cut it open with my wiz saw I found what is pictured and those 7 individual bundles appear to have lead melted on them but not through them and I was wondering if that lead is there from the heat which may have melted the lug end inside. I have never seen a battry cable do this in my life and I have had cars since 16 and am now 73??
 
Thanks for coming back and sharing the solution, that way others can learn from your experience.
 
Glad you've come forward and shown that those that said to throw a jumper cable on from battery to block and try were correct. At least Pnora saved you from frying your brand new headlight harness!

As for the main cable wires, YES... the best way to get a good "overpour" for connection would be to separate the main cable into smaller sections and then POUR the terminal end so the lead flows around everything and bonds into place.

Since you didn't show a "before" picture, I can't tell if that terminal end was swaged onto the cable or poured.
All this makes sense. Just looking at this I thought the factory just inserted the bunch into the end of the lug and pressed it with a press of sorts. I never thought that maybe the hole is larger and they poured some kind of lead in there. Looking closely inside, I would think that I would see where the two walls meeting together would look or appear different. I don't see that. And by the way, I was never going to install that new harness without first sorting this out. That would have not went well and I new it. I may try and call the company who made these cables to ask how they are made inside just for my own info.
 
OK. I appologize for saying the cable was perfect. My mistake in a world pf perfectionists. So now that I installed a new cable and proved you guys to be correct, I am trying to understand what I posted in the pictures Funny, I can wire a whole house with a/c power but this dc **** confuses me and I stated that from right up front. The cables on this car were bought from Year One and were factory correct made in USA cables. I am trying to understand what would have caused this to happen so I know next time what to look for, because as I stated early on, (that cable looked perfect) No melting of outer jscket, no white phosphorus, no green copper oxidation amd very clean unpainted connections as per install instructions. So, if you cannot see inside that battery cable to battery connector, I would say (it looked perfect). Which now I am trying to understand why or what caused the high resistance in that cable. The outer jcket went right up to that lead and hid any view of the wire. But when I cut it open with my wiz saw I found what is pictured and those 7 individual bundles appear to have lead melted on them but not through them and I was wondering if that lead is there from the heat which may have melted the lug end inside. I have never seen a battry cable do this in my life and I have had cars since 16 and am now 73??
73 You old geezer. You got me by 3. You had the horse with blinders syndrome. We all get that and that's why we neglect to see the problem when its biting the tip of your nose. When you assume something is when you get bit. You assumed the cable was perfect. Got ya. All of us that tried to help you have our own techniques on diagnosing the problem. Yours was simple and I would of figured it out in minutes. Seen many cable failures even on brand new cars. Glad you got it figured out. For what its worth AC is not a whole lot different than DC. AC just bites you quicker. And no you can not help me wire a house. [lol] Military says you cant expect what you don't inspect.
 
Most cables they drop a low melt point pellet into socket then
quick heat cable in or just crimp.
So there is no flux used as when I splice wires and solder them? No flux creates really no bond? No bond means room for corrosion, dampness ect to set in? So that low melt **** only makes a quick for the factory cable but not really a bulletproof build. That is what I find fascinating from a made in USA manufacturer. Little **** like that is why the space shuttle exploded, right?
 
I was trying to think of what is soldered in house wiring and I came up empty handed.

All mechanically connected.
Wonder what the code book says about soldering.
 
73 You old geezer. You got me by 3. You had the horse with blinders syndrome. We all get that and that's why we neglect to see the problem when its biting the tip of your nose. When you assume something is when you get bit. You assumed the cable was perfect. Got ya. All of us that tried to help you have our own techniques on diagnosing the problem. Yours was simple and I would of figured it out in minutes. Seen many cable failures even on brand new cars. Glad you got it figured out. For what its worth AC is not a whole lot different than DC. AC just bites you quicker. And no you can not help me wire a house. [lol] Military says you cant expect what you don't inspect.
I got it. Being in construction, I always tell my customers we need to really look close, but the key here is the word look. And I very much understand the crap we are making today from hand me down recycled garbage. But believe me, my antennas were up the whole time. I was listening just slow to react. Thanks much. Lesson learned. Ask me a carpentry question.......
 
I was trying to think of what is soldered in house wiring and I came up empty handed.

All mechanically connected.
Wonder what the code book says about soldering.
..and as I pull my grade 11 Electricity book from the shelves and it shows how to twist and solder house connection splices.. LMAO...
 
I got it. Being in construction, I always tell my customers we need to really look close, but the key here is the word look. And I very much understand the crap we are making today from hand me down recycled garbage. But believe me, my antennas were up the whole time. I was listening just slow to react. Thanks much. Lesson learned. Ask me a carpentry question.......
Why is it when you cut a board for a second time it still is to short.
 
I was trying to think of what is soldered in house wiring and I came up empty handed.

All mechanically connected.
Wonder what the code book says about soldering.
Never soldered anything in house wiring? I was talking about stranded wire connections. Speaker wires ect. I find flux and solder to be much better then crimp on ****. In my cars. Not in my house. Always wire nuts sized per the wire guage and how many together. Unless I use THHN wire in commercial applications.
 
I bet most mass produced cables have cast ends. Crimp on cable ends are usually made of harder material.
 
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