Rare Earth Minerals Needed for EV Batteries Turn Villages to Ruins

[yella71]

wheres that gretta? ....put her to work in the mines in china and then we will see how much she likes 0 emisions tech.....

 

[Rick62]

View attachment 1011572 Here's one for you!

Greta always looks angry. Did someone tell her there's no Santa Claus?

 

[yella71]

Santa said he wont be able to get to net 0 emissions till at least 2050 or later.....its cold at the north pole and he still has lots of fossil fuel stock piled to keep warm......

 

[ricks_RR]

his fossil fuel is ( reindeer s##t ) so he good for a long time

 

[copper67sat]

Those dam lamps containing CFL's cause more harm to the environment than the energy that they save over their lifetime.
A fact that the Greenies conveniently don't talk about now.

Remember when we had "resonant start' fluorescent light fittings....the ballasts in those contain even worse material - PCB's. (Polychlorinated biphenyls)

This has been a sore spot for me for a while. Good old incandescent bulbs worked just fine in our house and typically lasted many yrs - some are 14 yr old originals. We have 9-12 ft ceilings with a lot of high hats containing 100W BR20 or BR40 bulbs, most on dimmer switches. As the original incandescents starting burning out, we had to replace them with "equivalent" CFLs. They are NOT equivalent, they were more expensive, they wouldn't work with our dimmers so had to replace the switches and they lasted only a fraction of the time, especially in high hats (my guess is they overheat), plus they take a while to come on. The newer LEDs are better, but still more expensive and hard to match the brightness and color of the incandescents - once I have to change one in a room, I pretty much need change all.

Supposed to be a big energy saver, but we see no real effect on our electric usage/bill because the big drivers for us are 2 A/C units running almost yr round, water pump, pool pump and electric appliances. I could leave all the lights off and it might lower my bill 1-2%.

Throw in the mfg and disposal costs and you'll never convince that these are better.
Never should have been a national. mandate. Let the greenies virtue signal all they want, but let ME decide whether I want to spend $20 on a bulb that might save me 50c/month in electric or not (NOT).

Same goes with EVs. Ok for some applications, but I can't see them becoming the standard mode of transport any time soon. That's why they lobby for gov't mandates to force the issue because they can't compete otherwise.

Rant over

 

[alfaitalia]

Greta always looks angry. Did someone tell her there's no Santa Claus?

WHAT?.....NO SANTA CLAUS!.......SINCE WHEN?

 

[Dipstick]

And your "old car" will save some iron ore when it's melted down to make new steel.

 

[kiwigtx]

This has been a sore spot for me for a while. Good old incandescent bulbs worked just fine in our house and typically lasted many yrs - some are 14 yr old originals. We have 9-12 ft ceilings with a lot of high hats containing 100W BR20 or BR40 bulbs, most on dimmer switches. As the original incandescents starting burning out, we had to replace them with "equivalent" CFLs. They are NOT equivalent, they were more expensive, they wouldn't work with our dimmers so had to replace the switches and they lasted only a fraction of the time, especially in high hats (my guess is they overheat), plus they take a while to come on. The newer LEDs are better, but still more expensive and hard to match the brightness and color of the incandescents - once I have to change one in a room, I pretty much need change all.

Supposed to be a big energy saver, but we see no real effect on our electric usage/bill because the big drivers for us are 2 A/C units running almost yr round, water pump, pool pump and electric appliances. I could leave all the lights off and it might lower my bill 1-2%.

Throw in the mfg and disposal costs and you'll never convince that these are better.
Never should have been a national. mandate. Let the greenies virtue signal all they want, but let ME decide whether I want to spend $20 on a bulb that might save me 50c/month in electric or not (NOT).

Same goes with EVs. Ok for some applications, but I can't see them becoming the standard mode of transport any time soon. That's why they lobby for gov't mandates to force the issue because they can't compete otherwise.

Rant over

Thanks.

The mercury content in these CFL lamps has never been mentioned by the Greenie movement when they were pushing for the lamps to become mandated around the globe - all in the name of saving energy. The facts are that the CFL lamps cause more harm to the environment that the benefits they provide by way of lower power consumption. There is a vast amount of science behind why these awful lamps should never have come to prominence in the first place. Even prisoners do not like them...the glass is much to thin to be used successfully as a Meth smoking device....an Incandescent lamp has much tougher glass.

The CFL lamp has a driver in the base which gets extremely hot, and has been proven to be the root cause of many house fires. Yes, an Incandescent lamp can be the cause of a fire, but it is more likely to be as a result of a poor termination in the fitting that he lamp is plugged/screwed into. CFL lamps have already been phased out (Sparky joke) here in NZ, and their day has passed. Although still available in some stores, the Greenies have grown to be silent over pushing their usage.

LED fittings are the way of the current future, and who knows what lays ahead for lighting technology. The biggest hurdle for people to convert to LED is now only the price point....happily that is coming down every day. It is getting easier to convince people to change - benefits include a brighter output per watt consumed, lower temperature of fitting, ability to cover the fitting with insulation directly in some cases, meaning that 'blown-in' insulation is now not a fire risk. A range of colour temperatures is also a nice advantage.

The biggest advantage is that the LED fittings do not require exotic and rare earth metals in their production - unlike EV batteries. The EV (and Solar storage) battery will probably end up being more of a long-term problem to society than nuclear waste will ever be.

 

[DeltaV]

Thanks.

The mercury content in these CFL lamps has never been mentioned by the Greenie movement when they were pushing for the lamps to become mandated around the globe - all in the name of saving energy. The facts are that the CFL lamps cause more harm to the environment that the benefits they provide by way of lower power consumption. There is a vast amount of science behind why these awful lamps should never have come to prominence in the first place. Even prisoners do not like them...the glass is much to thin to be used successfully as a Meth smoking device....an Incandescent lamp has much tougher glass.

The CFL lamp has a driver in the base which gets extremely hot, and has been proven to be the root cause of many house fires. Yes, an Incandescent lamp can be the cause of a fire, but it is more likely to be as a result of a poor termination in the fitting that he lamp is plugged/screwed into. CFL lamps have already been phased out (Sparky joke) here in NZ, and their day has passed. Although still available in some stores, the Greenies have grown to be silent over pushing their usage.

LED fittings are the way of the current future, and who knows what lays ahead for lighting technology. The biggest hurdle for people to convert to LED is now only the price point....happily that is coming down every day. It is getting easier to convince people to change - benefits include a brighter output per watt consumed, lower temperature of fitting, ability to cover the fitting with insulation directly in some cases, meaning that 'blown-in' insulation is now not a fire risk. A range of colour temperatures is also a nice advantage.

The biggest advantage is that the LED fittings do not require exotic and rare earth metals in their production - unlike EV batteries. The EV (and Solar storage) battery will probably end up being more of a long-term problem to society than nuclear waste will ever be.

 

[DeltaV]

Somebody said Rare Earth? Ok...

 

[Photon440]

The mercury content in these CFL lamps has never been mentioned by the Greenie movement when they were pushing for the lamps to become mandated around the globe - all in the name of saving energy. The facts are that the CFL lamps cause more harm to the environment that the benefits they provide by way of lower power consumption. There is a vast amount of science behind why these awful lamps should never have come to prominence in the first place. Even prisoners do not like them...the glass is much to thin to be used successfully as a Meth smoking device....an Incandescent lamp has much tougher glass.

Actually, the mercury problem is often mentioned and is well covered in EPA documents. For places with clean electricity then yes, an increase in mercury in the environment is going to be inevitable. But if your power is coal generated, then the reverse is true. There are far more mercury emissions released from burning coal than go into CFLs, and if power consumption is reduced by switching to these lower wattage bulbs, less mercury from burning coal is the result.

Aside from that, who even uses them any more? Everyone I know switched to LED years ago.

 

[toolmanmike]

And your "old car" will save some iron ore when it's melted down to make new steel.

And good quality iron too. A local salvage yard sold 50 or so tractors back to John Deere foundry to be recycled. Tons of good quality cast iron from the teens and early 20's of the last century.

 

[Hey-O]

This has been a sore spot for me for a while. Good old incandescent bulbs worked just fine in our house and typically lasted many yrs - some are 14 yr old originals. We have 9-12 ft ceilings with a lot of high hats containing 100W BR20 or BR40 bulbs, most on dimmer switches. As the original incandescents starting burning out, we had to replace them with "equivalent" CFLs. They are NOT equivalent, they were more expensive, they wouldn't work with our dimmers so had to replace the switches and they lasted only a fraction of the time, especially in high hats (my guess is they overheat), plus they take a while to come on. The newer LEDs are better, but still more expensive and hard to match the brightness and color of the incandescents - once I have to change one in a room, I pretty much need change all.

Supposed to be a big energy saver, but we see no real effect on our electric usage/bill because the big drivers for us are 2 A/C units running almost yr round, water pump, pool pump and electric appliances. I could leave all the lights off and it might lower my bill 1-2%.

Throw in the mfg and disposal costs and you'll never convince that these are better.
Never should have been a national. mandate. Let the greenies virtue signal all they want, but let ME decide whether I want to spend $20 on a bulb that might save me 50c/month in electric or not (NOT).

Same goes with EVs. Ok for some applications, but I can't see them becoming the standard mode of transport any time soon. That's why they lobby for gov't mandates to force the issue because they can't compete otherwise.

Rant over

If you like incandescent bulbs and want them to last longer, use 220v bulbs. 220v bulb will glow at roughly 50% of the brightness of the 110v lamp assuming the wattage are the same, but with a thicker filament the bulb will last almost forever.

 

[Photon440]

Light output from tungsten filaments is non-linear to power input. Cutting the voltage in half will give you far less than half the brightness.

 

[kiwigtx]

If you like incandescent bulbs and want them to last longer, use 220v bulbs. 220v bulb will glow at roughly 50% of the brightness of the 110v lamp assuming the wattage are the same, but with a thicker filament the bulb will last almost forever.

Over here we have what are called 'Rough service' lamps - they are rated at 260 Volts....our supply is 230 Volts single phase.
They last an incredibly long time, as the in-rush current to the filament has less of an impact on it.
It is said that the Dutch (Philips) had created a lamp that would last for ever virtually...but the plans were to not putt them into production...as people would stop buying something that didn't need replacing eventually.

 

[Hey-O]

Light output from tungsten filaments is non-linear to power input. Cutting the voltage in half will give you far less than half the brightness.
View attachment 1012339

I've heard up to a quarter less. If I remember right.

 

[Hey-O]

Over here we have what are called 'Rough service' lamps - they are rated at 260 Volts....our supply is 230 Volts single phase.
They last an incredibly long time, as the in-rush current to the filament has less of an impact on it.
It is said that the Dutch (Philips) had created a lamp that would last for ever virtually...but the plans were to not putt them into production...as people would stop buying something that didn't need replacing eventually.

My father told me the same thing in Germany. At work we had places in stairwells where we used 220 bulbs because no one wanted to replace them. One was in the plant from 1959.

 

[Photon440]

Standard household voltage in Germany is 230 anyway, a 110 bulb would lead a short but brilliant life.

 

[kiwigtx]

Standard household voltage in Germany is 230 anyway, a 110 bulb would lead a short but brilliant life.

I sold a whole tray of 110Volt lamps in a garage sale before I left England years ago. Some smart-*** bought the lot for next to nothing. He probably got home and tried them all before realising the reason they would blow instantly.

 

[GetX'd]

EV and light bulbs are one thing - Rare earth minerals are also a necessary component in defense technologies and many other sensitive applications. China pretty much controls the worlds supply. We have access to very little of our own assets. The Chinese have more than once threatened to squeeze our supply. The Trump administration has started to ramp up domestic mining and subsidies are starting to support the efforts. Our mines have long been dormant and so unprofitable that like with so many other things we just relied on the unreliable - China to provide our supplies. Very late in the game we now know what a mistake that’s been. Hopefully Trump stays in office and the mining efforts continue. I’m not sure but I also think there are efforts underway to eliminate or reduce the need for this limited supply material.