Picked up new motor this weekend may need smaller CAM.....

[mopar 3 B]

Funny if this was meant to be a street engine someone would have suggested this build. He buys it this way and everybody wants him to disarm it before he even gets it started.

 

[Jeremiah]

You guys are getting old. I'd drive the hell out of that on the street. So what if it has a choppy idle @1100 RPM? If you get a decent converter it should street drive fine with 3.55-up gears.

The only things I'd be worried about the street driving that are valve train related. The Indy rockers, valve springs/ret/locks and roller lifters could be a weak link if you let it idle in traffic.

You could always put a hydraulic roller in it and swap someone for a 4150 flange intake. That would make it a bit more forgiving to tune and greatly reduce maintenance. With the stuff you have now you will be checking the valve last with the oil changes, which will be done every 1000 or so miles.

FWIW, I plugged some numbers into one of the Wallace Racing calculators and assuming that the heads flow 360 CFM on the intake @ 440 CI it spit out the following:

The HP for your Cylinder Head Flow of 360
is 740 at a RPM Range of 7,029 to 8,529
for your engine size of 440 CID

I'd think a stock stroke engine with 440-1 heads would love to rev. That could be fun on the street : )

 

[Kern Dog]

$5000 w/TTI Headers

Holy crap! If that thing runs, you made an excellent deal! The parts alone are $$$$, then the machine work, the assembly....
GOOD for you, man!! :headbang:

 

[Phil McGrath]

I would drop in a little smaller cam .620 In and Ex. after lash your close too .600 lift on both sides. Intake duration @.050 236* Exh duration 242*@.050 on a 112 center installed@ 108 Should still pull like a freight train.

 

[2quick]

That's the plan new cam (staying with solid roller means less money on lifters) good converter 3500-3800 and around 3.90 gears. Maybe later i'll install Gear Vendors OD, So at least i can cruise 85 at 3500+ RPM.
This will not be a daily driver by any means, Cars shows, drag strip, around town making noise, How bad could it be? I want a little nasty!

 

[onephat66]

Ok fellas, Super-bee_ski has a good point, so for those who are "griping" about it just hang on, he has a strong, valid point. I have a stock stroke 440 with B1/BS heads, 950 HP Holley on a single plane M1 and Crower cam with .574/.586 lift and TTI headers, it blazes the tires anywhere it goes if I let it. Starts up and idles first crank every time, but when actually putting on the street and driving it, whether just going for a ride, to the store, cruise night, etc. it is a bear to drive a lot of the time. I have 3:91 gears with 28" tall tire, oh yeah, and I have a 4 speed, which makes a very radical engine easier to drive on the street. I like the suggestion to put the motor in the car, see how you like it 2quick, then if it's more than you're wanting, just do as Super-bee_ski originally stated, or at least use his suggestion as your starting point to "de-tune" as needed. Thing to remember is, you change 1 part out and the others most likely will not be matched correctly. Oh, and these will pull to 7,500 if they have good parts. Mine makes power to 7200. By the way 2quick, how's the body coming along? Been waiting for updates on the bodywork.... :toothy5:

 

[2quick]

Body is coming along, Still on rotisserie, Most metal work is finally done (No more welding) Everything is in High Build primer in various stages of final blocking. Undercarriage done and in paint (Viper Silver) Still have engine bay and inside trunk left. My goal is to have it done for Carlisle 2016. Fingers Crossed!



- - - Updated - - -

View attachment 292715View attachment 292721

 

[Richard Cranium]

I had all intentions to build a fast street car that would see occasional track use but 90% of the time would be fair weather street driven, cruised, and car showed. The problem is I'm not sure I can bring this motor down to an acceptable street car with such big heads, Cam, and Intake.View attachment 292587

I think you answered your own question. That big open intake & heads are for high RPM use & on the street, it would suck. You probably know this, but there is no way that is going to fit under stock hood. Listen to Super-Bee Ski, he is correct.

 

[super-bee_ski]

Thanks onephat66!
All good points!

Thanks seventy, I'm sure 2quick has a very strong and well built engine there.
Heck, the short block alone is well worth the $5K!
All the best components.
Cant beat that!

Thanks RC,

2quick: It's looking good!

 

[2quick]

Obviously I have some time to think about this (as you can see from the Body work Pics) I'll let it sit around for awhile and see where it takes me.

As far as not fitting under stock hood This may help? Maybe? would it? Anyone run a 440-2 under a 66-67 super stock scoop on a glass hood?

From my hotel room in Carlisle last year:

 

[Mike Gaines]

Well...you got a good deal for a race motor...but not for a streetable setup.
1) The intake manifold is way to big, probably wont even fit under your hood, even with a scoop.
2) The intake only accepts a dominator carb which cannot be streetable and dominators cost about $900 even if you got one.
3) You cant use a carb adapter to snake down the flange to a 4150 square bore size..it just wont work.
4) Header would be OK, just wasted performance potential...you need 1 7/8 for street/strip
and a lot more....pm me and I will give you my 2 cents worth of advice.
Regards, Mike

 

[Phil McGrath]

Well this may be old school thinking but any cam with more than 250* duration at .050 really starts knocking off the bottom end. Not that its a real problem with a 440 but it really starts moving the rpm band up, up, and way and that's not good for a heavy street car with a big converter. Now with 10.5 compression on the street I like too see no more than 240*, it doesn't bleed compression down low and brings the power band where you can use it better. With .600 lift those heads are moving plenty of good air your going too still have all the top end you can handle while keeping it pointed straight. So why spin it hard if you don't have too....

Whatever direction you go, you gong too have a handful and while its up in the air I would seriously think about mini-tubs so you can try too keep it glued too the road that is if your going too have any hope of hooking this beast up at all. I've seen guys struggle with Dominators on the street, I myself would look at a nice high flowing 4150 carb.


My .02 and a 1.59 will get you a cup of large coffee.

 

[Longroof]

Change the intake, change the cam listen to Hughes, they will get you where you need to be. And buy the converter and gears to work with the cam. And you should run 11.50s or better without any trouble. This has the making of a great street / strip car.

 

[Kern Dog]

That's the plan new cam (staying with solid roller means less money on lifters) good converter 3500-3800 and around 3.90 gears. Maybe later i'll install Gear Vendors OD, So at least i can cruise 85 at 3500+ RPM.
This will not be a daily driver by any means, Cars shows, drag strip, around town making noise, How bad could it be? I want a little nasty!

I like your use of the word NASTY.
As a kid, I grew up thinking that "nasty" was synonymous with "Naughty". Hey, LOOK, she is a naughty girl! In my 30s, I started hearing the word Nasty be used to describe something that was disgusting or slimy. Ever have food at the Olive Garden? It is NASTY!
Thanks for taking Nasty[/I Back!

 

[2quick]

MINI TUBS I just painted it.....:violent-smiley-100:

Phil and Longroof are on the same page as me. But maybe i'll try and run the intake (Max Wedge ports) I'll run a 4150 - 4500 adapter. I work in a CNC MACHINE SHOP SO IF i HAVE TO I'LL MAKE IT FIT. Guys have been running 4150's on 4500 manifolds for years. May not be ideal but will work.

 

[super-bee_ski]

Well...you got a good deal for a race motor...but not for a streetable setup.
1) The intake manifold is way to big, probably wont even fit under your hood, even with a scoop.
2) The intake only accepts a dominator carb which cannot be streetable and dominators cost about $900 even if you got one.
3) You cant use a carb adapter to snake down the flange to a 4150 square bore size..it just wont work.
4) Header would be OK, just wasted performance potential...you need 1 7/8 for street/strip
and a lot more....pm me and I will give you my 2 cents worth of advice.
Regards, Mike

Sorry Mike,
I forgot to add your name on that list with IQ 52 and LewT
Of course, I was a little FOGGY this morning.
How could I forget you?
(Old age I guess...tee hee hee)

 

[HT413]

2quick, I think you and Mike should consider working out a trade - top end for top end.

Mike's Indy SEZ (non-max wedge port) heads, Indy Dual Plane and even the Mighty Demon 850 sound a lot more in line with a nasty street/strip monster, and if I recall, mike was recently lamenting his lack of max wedge ports.

The Dude abides.

 

[Phil McGrath]

Remember the short block has heavy TRW pistons and LY rods, I don't think I would spin it hard. A M1 single plane and a sweet 850cfm 4150 would make this a tuff combo. Buzz it too 63/6500 and live a good long life.

If 850cfm isn't enough carb, Bob Book makes a very custom 2bbl 4150 carb that can flow up too 1300cfm and still pull good signal.....

 

[Jeremiah]

MINI TUBS I just painted it.....:violent-smiley-100:

Phil and Longroof are on the same page as me. But maybe i'll try and run the intake (Max Wedge ports) I'll run a 4150 - 4500 adapter. I work in a CNC MACHINE SHOP SO IF i HAVE TO I'LL MAKE IT FIT. Guys have been running 4150's on 4500 manifolds for years. May not be ideal but will work.

HVH makes a super sucker that is 4150 to 4500 flange. I have two of them on my Indy 400-15 tunnel ram. So far I like your plan! When people say something is "not streetable" I'm never really sure what they mean. Does is drive like a new car? No, of course not because it's a MUSCLE CAR.

I am sure there are lots of well built, stock appearing engines that would leave a well prepped FAST car in the dust street light to street light but who does that type of Fonzi-style stuff anymore? If the bottom end is a little soft that will keep the car from blowing the tires off on the street every time you stand on it. My red car is pretty darn soft below 3500 and it actually makes it more forgiving to drive IMO. Sure it might lug a little when I leave a stop sign or it might need the throttle blipped to get enough fuel in the plenum for an uphill start but it's not any more thinking than driving a motorcycle. Again, all IMHO people can tolerate different levels of harsh ride, loud exhaust, etc. It's funny how people will put a 16:1 manual steering box in their car with 17" low profile front tires and turn around and build a lightly warmed over engine to make it "more streetable".

 

[2quick]

Well Stated Jeremiah!

So I had a chance to install the trans, Converter, and starter w/the engine on a dolly. Hooked up a battery and went thru the cylinders with compression gauge. Looks like 158psi -160psi across the board. Don't know if that's good, bad, or average but Hughes asked me for the numbers, so I got them.