150-200HP nitrous plate shot, on a 6bbl. Dual plane or Single plane intake??

Racers Hangout

  1. MiradaMegaCab

    MiradaMegaCab Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    226
    Likes Received:
    511
    Joined:
    Dec 3, 2013
    Location:
    Long Island
    Local Time:
    9:53 AM
    Ahh, Dominator flange carb?
    I’m sure your throttle blade won’t hit the Nitrous plate with the 1”spacer sandwiched between the carb and Nitrous plate.
    If it does.... You can always give the Nitrous plate to me:drinks:
     
    • Like Like x 2
    • HEMI-ITIS

      HEMI-ITIS STREETER on LI FBBO Gold Member

      Messages:
      10,984
      Likes Received:
      12716
      Joined:
      Dec 14, 2008
      Location:
      Long Island,New York
      Local Time:
      10:53 AM
      The SV1 throttle blade at wot is 1 1/8 below the mounting flange:D:nutkick:
       
    • moparcrazy

      moparcrazy Well-Known Member

      Messages:
      2,161
      Likes Received:
      1625
      Joined:
      Dec 27, 2009
      Location:
      california
      Local Time:
      9:53 AM
      Highly recomened a nitrous Progresser, im running a 200 shot with Edelbrock Progresser & the hit is so soft you cant even feel it hit compared to with out it, so definitely easier on the bottom end.

      edl-71900_w.jpg
       
      • Like Like x 1
      • Thanks! Thanks! x 1
      • Agree Agree x 1
      • biomedtechguy

        biomedtechguy Accelerati Rapidus Maximus FBBO Gold Member

        Messages:
        18,274
        Likes Received:
        24766
        Joined:
        Mar 28, 2014
        Location:
        South Louisiana
        Local Time:
        9:53 AM
        AGREED! I was just showing another setup. I already have one of the 2bbl spray plates from Nitrous Express, and the other option for the "NOS system originator guy" doing the intake for me has not yet been fleshed out. Even using a spray plate, if stealth is a concern, the Air Grabber 6bbl air cleaner could probably provide some "cover". I haven't really been concerned about hiding it though.
        I'm thinking that a properly designed build can work with a single plane intake and be quite drivable on the street. OTOH, I see that F&B used some kind of Edelbrock intake for the 3x2 EFI system. I have to see which one they used, and why (what was the rest of the build like). I know for a fact that F&B has setup the Indy ModMan intake with a 3x2 EFI system, and the ModMan intake has fuel injector bosses cast in. So if dual plane, then I already have the Edelbrock/Chrysler aluminum 6bbl intake, which I would be inclined to do a knife edge "Vanke" modification to, but if single plane, then the ModMan intake seems to be the only one available, but F&B has already confirmed that it works great with the EFI 3x2 system, although I have to try my Promax modded Holley carbs on it first.
        The linkage on the F&B 3x2 EFI is progressive, but the Holley carb setup, which is where I would start, is not.
        I would have a micro switch on one of the 2 outboard carbs, to use as one of the triggers for the nitrous system to activate. I would also have a one second delay after that switch is triggered, so it doesn't spray during the brief "outboard carbs tip in lean spike" window. I've seen the lean spike on tip in, with my Innovate Motorsports dual wideband O2 system, and it goes to about 19 or 20 to 1 A/F ratio for a little less than 1 second. The F&B 3x2 EFI I would imagine wouldn't have that problem.
        Thanks. I plan on using a Nitrous Express S.A.F.E. tank and pump system. It is especially compatible with my mechanical fuel pump and carburetor setup. It allows for totally independent fuel delivery and pressure, and because of the separate fuel tank, I can run AVgas or some of the Turbo Blue Sonoco 109 octane fuel that I have left over from the 55 gallon drum I bought, which was an effort to resolve a detonation problem we had with the 421 in the GTO. Although the 421 had 11:1 (or possibly more) compression ratio with modified iron cylinder heads, it was the timing being way, way too far advanced that was the problem, and foolishly that was the last thing I checked. It was rebuilt with .035 over forged aluminum pistons that have a slight dish for a CR of 10:1.
        Anyway, by running a high octane fuel that gets mixed with the nitrous for the shot, that will be an added measure of safety, along with whatever else is in place.
        I am totally on board with that, certainly while I am running carburetors. If I made the switch to 3x2 EFI, then the EFI control system would handle the nitrous management, AFAIK.
        I guess I will have to consider going to a 3x2 EFI system from the jump with the stroker motor, and calculate the costs of add on management devices to handle the peripheral duties of the nitrous setup vs the cost of the EFI system and its controller, but as it stands I am praying that I can put together enough money to make the build happen, and I most likely won't even have any nitrous on it from the get go. We'll see.
        GREAT INFO guys! THANK YOU for posting about this!
         
        • Like Like x 2
        • Hemirunner

          Hemirunner Well-Known Member

          Messages:
          4,218
          Likes Received:
          4577
          Joined:
          Jul 12, 2011
          Location:
          Down South
          Local Time:
          9:53 AM
          I’ve hidden a few of them over the years. This system was not visible at all. Even the solenoids were covered by something that resembled the shield over the oil pressure sender.

          2C8DFEE9-296E-423F-9063-A534D48E890C.jpeg 8D3E8095-230F-4736-8598-B6D639BFB0D1.jpeg
           
          • Like Like x 4
          • Thanks! Thanks! x 1
          • biomedtechguy

            biomedtechguy Accelerati Rapidus Maximus FBBO Gold Member

            Messages:
            18,274
            Likes Received:
            24766
            Joined:
            Mar 28, 2014
            Location:
            South Louisiana
            Local Time:
            9:53 AM
            Wow, so the nitrous and fuel are tapped into the cylinder head ports!?!
             
            • Like Like x 1
            • Hemirunner

              Hemirunner Well-Known Member

              Messages:
              4,218
              Likes Received:
              4577
              Joined:
              Jul 12, 2011
              Location:
              Down South
              Local Time:
              9:53 AM
              Yes. It allowed the intake to be removed and swapped or reinstalled without dealing with nitrous lines and equipment.
               
              • Like Like x 2
              • biomedtechguy

                biomedtechguy Accelerati Rapidus Maximus FBBO Gold Member

                Messages:
                18,274
                Likes Received:
                24766
                Joined:
                Mar 28, 2014
                Location:
                South Louisiana
                Local Time:
                9:53 AM
                Well...THAT is going "all in" on using nitrous as a power adder and making that a significant part of the whole equation.
                I guess you could block the nozzle holes in the cylinder heads if you changed your mind.
                So it seems like piston ring gap may be the only pre-planned difference between a "nitrous motor" and one that doesn't use "the spray".
                If nitrous was only an occasional use item, like when I wanted or needed to use it to "step up" from what I would consider my "normal competition", what should I do about piston ring gap, given that using nitrous would only happen occasionally?
                I wouldn't want the "ring gap for nitrous" to have a negative impact on my engine, given that the nitrous would only be used every now and then.
                 
                • Like Like x 1
                • JackpotJim

                  JackpotJim Well-Known Member

                  Messages:
                  89
                  Likes Received:
                  107
                  Joined:
                  Oct 7, 2018
                  Location:
                  Minnesota
                  Local Time:
                  9:53 AM
                  Depending on how big of shot you are going with limit length of time of you apply nitrous into motor. Anything over 6 seconds on a motor without correct ring gap is asking for bad things to happen. I think if you are just applying 75 or 100 shot you should be OK with longer sprays, 150 and up I would be careful. Just my opinion.
                   
                  • Thanks! Thanks! x 1
                  • Hemirunner

                    Hemirunner Well-Known Member

                    Messages:
                    4,218
                    Likes Received:
                    4577
                    Joined:
                    Jul 12, 2011
                    Location:
                    Down South
                    Local Time:
                    9:53 AM
                    As far as ring gap goes, you’ll want to add some for a sizeable shot. Additional ring gap isn’t going to negatively affect anything.
                     
                    • Agree Agree x 2
                    • Thanks! Thanks! x 1
                    • HEMI-ITIS

                      HEMI-ITIS STREETER on LI FBBO Gold Member

                      Messages:
                      10,984
                      Likes Received:
                      12716
                      Joined:
                      Dec 14, 2008
                      Location:
                      Long Island,New York
                      Local Time:
                      10:53 AM
                      Better to have too much gap than not enough:thumbsup: Gap it larger than whatever you THINK you will spray,because a little will make you want a little MORE!:poke::lol:
                       
                      • Like Like x 1
                      • Thanks! Thanks! x 1
                      • biomedtechguy

                        biomedtechguy Accelerati Rapidus Maximus FBBO Gold Member

                        Messages:
                        18,274
                        Likes Received:
                        24766
                        Joined:
                        Mar 28, 2014
                        Location:
                        South Louisiana
                        Local Time:
                        9:53 AM
                        That could apply to a couple of important things in life...:bananadance::D
                        Well you know, I'm just guessing, but I am trying to make it an "informed guess".
                        As I've suggested before, the straight up power of a successful build may be all I can handle. Chances are that I will get everything worked out, and while never losing focus or respect for what that kind of power and speed can do, I may find myself wanting to expand the number of cars I can compete with, or just have a "little something extra" for that occasional call out that I really want to win.
                        The point is, I envision using nitrous as an "oh shit" button, where I've taken on a race and in the last 1/3rd of the 1320 I see headlights approaching faster than I'd like, or I've seen taillights the first half of the track, but "if I only had another 150 horsepower" I could pass this guy. Maybe lose the first race out of 3, and offer double or nothing, or see that a few seconds "on the spray" means winning the next 2 races.
                        That translates into a generally limited amount of time I'd be on the button, and if 150 HP shot is within the safe zone, taking into account all of the other safety measures I've discussed being in place, well then that's the limit, and if that doesn't get it done, then I either get an offset in negotiations (the hit, X # of car lengths, etc etc) or I move on to choosing another competitor.
                         
                        • Like Like x 1
                        • Agree Agree x 1
                        • JackpotJim

                          JackpotJim Well-Known Member

                          Messages:
                          89
                          Likes Received:
                          107
                          Joined:
                          Oct 7, 2018
                          Location:
                          Minnesota
                          Local Time:
                          9:53 AM
                          You should have a fun set up. I change jets in my set up to run either 150 or 200 HP shot. If at the strip I'll hit the nitrous once I'm in high gear and I know fuel pressure looks good. Your fuel solenoid (if running a wet plate system) electrical connection should be checked often. Loss of fuel pressure or fuel solenoid failure in a wet system is probably number one cause of engine damage on plate system motor.
                           
                          • Like Like x 1
                          • Thanks! Thanks! x 1
                          • biomedtechguy

                            biomedtechguy Accelerati Rapidus Maximus FBBO Gold Member

                            Messages:
                            18,274
                            Likes Received:
                            24766
                            Joined:
                            Mar 28, 2014
                            Location:
                            South Louisiana
                            Local Time:
                            9:53 AM
                            Easy to do in my center and outboard carbs thanks to the Promax parts.
                            Here's the Nitrous Express SAFE system for a carbureted system:
                            nex-15003_ml.jpg
                            https://www.summitracing.com/parts/nex-15003/
                            If I were to switch to a F&B EFI system, the supporting hardware would likely change. Nitrous Express makes a secondary fuel pump and cell with a high pressure fuel delivery option too.
                             
                            • Like Like x 2
                            • biomedtechguy

                              biomedtechguy Accelerati Rapidus Maximus FBBO Gold Member

                              Messages:
                              18,274
                              Likes Received:
                              24766
                              Joined:
                              Mar 28, 2014
                              Location:
                              South Louisiana
                              Local Time:
                              9:53 AM
                              The guy I spoke with at Carlisle, several years ago, who actually called and spoke with the "NOS original guy"....
                              I looked up the name of the NOS guru who supposedly offered to take my Edelbrock/Chrysler aluminum 6bbl intake and add nitrous to it is.....
                              Mike Thermos
                              I guess if that opportunity still exists, I have to at least see what he has in mind, right?!
                              Chances are that if I do make a move on adding nitrous to what already should be a 6XX HP and 650+ft lbs torque motor, it would be one hell of a good reason to go with Mike rather than complete the "off the shelf" Nitrous Express system, that I already have the spray plate for.
                              Still, Mike may have something in mind so far superior that he could make an offer I couldn't refuse! Lol.
                               
                              • Like Like x 1
                              • Dodge 330

                                Dodge 330 Well-Known Member

                                Messages:
                                1,066
                                Likes Received:
                                663
                                Joined:
                                Nov 3, 2010
                                Location:
                                Wichita, KS
                                Local Time:
                                9:53 AM
                                Here is a shot of my plate sytem that is semi-hidden. With the air cleaner on, it's pretty hard to see. Only a couple.of guys have noticed it.

                                20171130_145951.jpg
                                 
                                • Like Like x 2
                                • Dodge 330

                                  Dodge 330 Well-Known Member

                                  Messages:
                                  1,066
                                  Likes Received:
                                  663
                                  Joined:
                                  Nov 3, 2010
                                  Location:
                                  Wichita, KS
                                  Local Time:
                                  9:53 AM
                                  Another shot:

                                  20180122_155910.jpg
                                   
                                  • Like Like x 5
                                  • Dodge 330

                                    Dodge 330 Well-Known Member

                                    Messages:
                                    1,066
                                    Likes Received:
                                    663
                                    Joined:
                                    Nov 3, 2010
                                    Location:
                                    Wichita, KS
                                    Local Time:
                                    9:53 AM
                                    3

                                    Screenshot_20191129-110513.jpg
                                     
                                    • Like Like x 5
                                    • biomedtechguy

                                      biomedtechguy Accelerati Rapidus Maximus FBBO Gold Member

                                      Messages:
                                      18,274
                                      Likes Received:
                                      24766
                                      Joined:
                                      Mar 28, 2014
                                      Location:
                                      South Louisiana
                                      Local Time:
                                      9:53 AM
                                      Is that a fabricated valley pan "brace" that the solenoids are mounted to? Bought or home made?
                                       
                                      • Like Like x 1
                                      • biomedtechguy

                                        biomedtechguy Accelerati Rapidus Maximus FBBO Gold Member

                                        Messages:
                                        18,274
                                        Likes Received:
                                        24766
                                        Joined:
                                        Mar 28, 2014
                                        Location:
                                        South Louisiana
                                        Local Time:
                                        9:53 AM
                                        If I use a center carb spray plate (as Nitrous Express intended) I have to bring the hose in from the side, in between the center carb and the front or rear carb.
                                        I have the benefit of the huge oval Air Grabber air cleaner base to hide stuff with, provided I have enough room between the base and the heads/intake runners.
                                        Thanks for the pix.
                                        Waiting for the answer about the valley pan edge cover plate.....
                                         
                                        • Like Like x 1
                                        1. This site uses cookies to help personalise content, tailor your experience and to keep you logged in if you register.
                                          By continuing to use this site, you are consenting to our use of cookies.